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	<title>Comments on: Three Australian Ex-Gay Leaders Apologize</title>
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	<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2007/08/16/658</link>
	<description>News, analysis and fact-checking of anti-gay rhetoric</description>
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		<title>By: Ken R</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2007/08/16/658/comment-page-1#comment-1810</link>
		<dc:creator>Ken R</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 19 Aug 2007 09:38:12 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I agree with you AM. They are constantly inconsistent with their beliefs. They demand celibacy for gays without question but would never hold to those same demands for straights when it came to divorce and remarriage. You would most likely get funny looks if you demanded that they adhere to the celibacy rule. Jesus himself spoke against divorce and remarriage except in cases of adultery. And only adultery. Would you hold a battered wife that had no recourse but to divorce her husband to this same celibacy rules? You would have to if one is to take scripture literally. That wife must now live a lifetime of celibacy because leaving a spouse because of abuse is not one of the options Christ allowed for divorce and remarriage to occur. The Bible doesn&#039;t say it is ok, so it must wrong. I can see many Christian heads spinning on this all the while they try to justify the sin. 

I would love to see support groups for those divorced straights that have to remain celibate. It would be like a cold bucket of ice water in their faces when they realize that they themselves cannot possibly live up to their own religious interpretations.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with you AM. They are constantly inconsistent with their beliefs. They demand celibacy for gays without question but would never hold to those same demands for straights when it came to divorce and remarriage. You would most likely get funny looks if you demanded that they adhere to the celibacy rule. Jesus himself spoke against divorce and remarriage except in cases of adultery. And only adultery. Would you hold a battered wife that had no recourse but to divorce her husband to this same celibacy rules? You would have to if one is to take scripture literally. That wife must now live a lifetime of celibacy because leaving a spouse because of abuse is not one of the options Christ allowed for divorce and remarriage to occur. The Bible doesn&#8217;t say it is ok, so it must wrong. I can see many Christian heads spinning on this all the while they try to justify the sin. </p>
<p>I would love to see support groups for those divorced straights that have to remain celibate. It would be like a cold bucket of ice water in their faces when they realize that they themselves cannot possibly live up to their own religious interpretations.</p>
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		<title>By: AM</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2007/08/16/658/comment-page-1#comment-1807</link>
		<dc:creator>AM</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 19 Aug 2007 06:38:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2007/08/16/658#comment-1807</guid>
		<description>I received some of the remnants of my ex-gay days in my mailbox yesterday and while reading a denominational ministry&#039;s newsletter on why homosexual behvavior is wrong and how it can all be healed, I came up with an interesting thought.

Much of the appeal had to do with Scripture and the traditonal interpretation along with creative intent thrown in.  Nothing new there.

However, I got to thinking:  Why not have support groups for lifetime celibates -- those who Scripturally cannot have sex again -- the &quot;lifers&quot; along with the gay Christians who cannot change (most of them)?

Of course, I am referring to the divorced and remarried crowd -- many of whom did not have the Scriptural authority to marry.

Now, I am hypothetically suggesting this not because I believe it is necessary, myself, -- this concept, but because in all this intentness to provide &quot;help, healing, and hope&quot; to &quot;strugglers&quot;, we can put some real strugglers in there, too:  the straights who are now Biblically consigned to a life of celibacy.

Because the end game is where I see the fallacy of the Biblical &quot;seriousness&quot; in this issue:

If such groups did exist and the church used lifetime celibacy vis a vis&#039; support groups to restrict straight divorcees, I do believe the reality check would set in of what they are asking gays to do.

Imagine a Living Waters populated year after year with such people:  straights who are required to be lifetime celibates.  Probably the same tune of untenability would ring out with their stories that we have heard from gay Christians now for decades.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I received some of the remnants of my ex-gay days in my mailbox yesterday and while reading a denominational ministry&#8217;s newsletter on why homosexual behvavior is wrong and how it can all be healed, I came up with an interesting thought.</p>
<p>Much of the appeal had to do with Scripture and the traditonal interpretation along with creative intent thrown in.  Nothing new there.</p>
<p>However, I got to thinking:  Why not have support groups for lifetime celibates &#8212; those who Scripturally cannot have sex again &#8212; the &#8220;lifers&#8221; along with the gay Christians who cannot change (most of them)?</p>
<p>Of course, I am referring to the divorced and remarried crowd &#8212; many of whom did not have the Scriptural authority to marry.</p>
<p>Now, I am hypothetically suggesting this not because I believe it is necessary, myself, &#8212; this concept, but because in all this intentness to provide &#8220;help, healing, and hope&#8221; to &#8220;strugglers&#8221;, we can put some real strugglers in there, too:  the straights who are now Biblically consigned to a life of celibacy.</p>
<p>Because the end game is where I see the fallacy of the Biblical &#8220;seriousness&#8221; in this issue:</p>
<p>If such groups did exist and the church used lifetime celibacy vis a vis&#8217; support groups to restrict straight divorcees, I do believe the reality check would set in of what they are asking gays to do.</p>
<p>Imagine a Living Waters populated year after year with such people:  straights who are required to be lifetime celibates.  Probably the same tune of untenability would ring out with their stories that we have heard from gay Christians now for decades.</p>
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		<title>By: Ex-Gay Watch &#187; More Former Ex-Gay Leaders Apologize</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2007/08/16/658/comment-page-1#comment-1785</link>
		<dc:creator>Ex-Gay Watch &#187; More Former Ex-Gay Leaders Apologize</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Aug 2007 20:40:25 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>[...] coverage: Box Turtle Bulletin, Soulforce, and Beyond [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] coverage: Box Turtle Bulletin, Soulforce, and Beyond [...]</p>
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