Comments on: No Homosexuals At BYU. Nope. No Siree. http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2008/12/08/7159 News, analysis and fact-checking of anti-gay rhetoric Fri, 24 May 2013 15:24:24 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.4.2 By: jay hova http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2008/12/08/7159/comment-page-1#comment-27657 jay hova Sat, 13 Dec 2008 11:15:05 +0000 http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=7159#comment-27657 According to the story, the artwork was taken down because of a "administration miscommunication." If this is true and the work was quickly placed back up again censorship never took place. Mistakes happen, so don't get frustrated and see things that aren't really there. Isn't that the point of your artwork anyways? According to the story, the artwork was taken down because of a “administration miscommunication.” If this is true and the work was quickly placed back up again censorship never took place. Mistakes happen, so don’t get frustrated and see things that aren’t really there. Isn’t that the point of your artwork anyways?

]]> By: Andy http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2008/12/08/7159/comment-page-1#comment-27364 Andy Thu, 11 Dec 2008 17:25:17 +0000 http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=7159#comment-27364 I think everyone needs to step back and take a broader look at BYU, the LDS Church, and the world. BYU is a private university, and just like every other private university, they have their own specific way of dealing with the world and since they don't get state funding, they don't have to listen anyone else. Just like with ANY rule or methodology and ANY private school, if you're that opposed to it, don't go to BYU. It's true that you're not going to get what most people consider a "fair" view of homosexuality in America (again, if that's a problem, don't go there), but since it IS possible to get a great education without considering homosexuality, I would point out that many of BYU's programs are among the best in the world. It is true that there is a sub-set of LDS people who never leave Utah (except for a mission) and live in this "bubble" about how the world works, but these people do not represent the majority or the voice of the Church. No one should judge any group on just a small part of that group, even if that small part really makes them mad. I graduated from BYU, but grew up in the East and never plan on living in Utah again; everyone is too busy screaming for equality and an "end to hate" that they don't realize they're spreading discriminatory propaganda and hate messages themselves while they campaign against it. It's very true that this art would have been left alone to "be different" at almost any other school, but really, I'm shocked that ANYONE is surprised they took it down. That's like being surprised for getting a ticket after driving passed a group of police cars at 50 miles over the limit. BYU and the Church is quite clear about all types of issues that go against policies; they don't change just because society says it's popular to change and whether you agree or not is besides the point. You want to make a splash about homosexuals, fine, but you'll be more successful showing it in your basement than you will at BYU. Deal with it and work around the system; fighting it is just going to be fruitless. I agree that BYU handles ALL situations dealing with homosexuality extremely poorly and if nothing else, they could get the same results they want with much less backlash and fewer hurt feelings, but again, it's s private institution, so there's nothing anyone can do. This applies to everything about BYU, not just how they deal with homosexual items. If you really want to 'make a difference' you're going to get much better traction somewhere else. But if you're going to preach equality and tolerance, than you need to practice it as well. I have just as much right to believe that something is wrong as you have a right to believe it isn't, and just because you say it louder or more often doesn't mean your right is greater than mine. It's very true that we don't live in a theocracy, but we DO live in a democracy, which means the voice of the people governs. If you can convince enough people to believe the same way you do, then great, things will change. But until then, yelling and screaming and saying hateful things about people or groups or people or organizations who are only trying to uphold their constitutional right to believe as they see fit, will do nothing for your cause. Does anyone really want to live in a country where all it take to change anything is a loud enough minority? Step back and take a broader look; nothing is going to change overnight and no matter how much we may disagree on something, we both have the right to believe the way we each do. I think everyone needs to step back and take a broader look at BYU, the LDS Church, and the world. BYU is a private university, and just like every other private university, they have their own specific way of dealing with the world and since they don’t get state funding, they don’t have to listen anyone else. Just like with ANY rule or methodology and ANY private school, if you’re that opposed to it, don’t go to BYU.

It’s true that you’re not going to get what most people consider a “fair” view of homosexuality in America (again, if that’s a problem, don’t go there), but since it IS possible to get a great education without considering homosexuality, I would point out that many of BYU’s programs are among the best in the world. It is true that there is a sub-set of LDS people who never leave Utah (except for a mission) and live in this “bubble” about how the world works, but these people do not represent the majority or the voice of the Church. No one should judge any group on just a small part of that group, even if that small part really makes them mad. I graduated from BYU, but grew up in the East and never plan on living in Utah again; everyone is too busy screaming for equality and an “end to hate” that they don’t realize they’re spreading discriminatory propaganda and hate messages themselves while they campaign against it.

It’s very true that this art would have been left alone to “be different” at almost any other school, but really, I’m shocked that ANYONE is surprised they took it down. That’s like being surprised for getting a ticket after driving passed a group of police cars at 50 miles over the limit. BYU and the Church is quite clear about all types of issues that go against policies; they don’t change just because society says it’s popular to change and whether you agree or not is besides the point. You want to make a splash about homosexuals, fine, but you’ll be more successful showing it in your basement than you will at BYU. Deal with it and work around the system; fighting it is just going to be fruitless.

I agree that BYU handles ALL situations dealing with homosexuality extremely poorly and if nothing else, they could get the same results they want with much less backlash and fewer hurt feelings, but again, it’s s private institution, so there’s nothing anyone can do. This applies to everything about BYU, not just how they deal with homosexual items. If you really want to ‘make a difference’ you’re going to get much better traction somewhere else. But if you’re going to preach equality and tolerance, than you need to practice it as well. I have just as much right to believe that something is wrong as you have a right to believe it isn’t, and just because you say it louder or more often doesn’t mean your right is greater than mine. It’s very true that we don’t live in a theocracy, but we DO live in a democracy, which means the voice of the people governs. If you can convince enough people to believe the same way you do, then great, things will change. But until then, yelling and screaming and saying hateful things about people or groups or people or organizations who are only trying to uphold their constitutional right to believe as they see fit, will do nothing for your cause. Does anyone really want to live in a country where all it take to change anything is a loud enough minority?

Step back and take a broader look; nothing is going to change overnight and no matter how much we may disagree on something, we both have the right to believe the way we each do.

]]> By: Justin Bell http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2008/12/08/7159/comment-page-1#comment-27333 Justin Bell Thu, 11 Dec 2008 09:58:37 +0000 http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=7159#comment-27333 p.s. I never said that I am attracted to women. nor did I ever say that my brother is attracted to men. ya'll assumed that. p.s. I never said that I am attracted to women. nor did I ever say that my brother is attracted to men. ya’ll assumed that.

]]> By: Justin Bell http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2008/12/08/7159/comment-page-1#comment-27326 Justin Bell Thu, 11 Dec 2008 07:57:25 +0000 http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=7159#comment-27326 In response to all you fine people, I appreciate your comments. I went and looked at this exhibit today. It does not threaten anybody, not one little bit. Nor is anybody threatened that it was taken down. I love people who identify themselves as homosexual, I know at least two. I love all you. Same sex attraction is not a choice. Homosexual behavior however, is a choice that I cannot condone. My final comments on this is that I love all of you and don't expect you to agree with me. Nor should you expect me to agree with you. I am tolerant. Tolerance is a two-way street. In response to all you fine people, I appreciate your comments. I went and looked at this exhibit today. It does not threaten anybody, not one little bit. Nor is anybody threatened that it was taken down. I love people who identify themselves as homosexual, I know at least two. I love all you. Same sex attraction is not a choice. Homosexual behavior however, is a choice that I cannot condone.
My final comments on this is that I love all of you and don’t expect you to agree with me. Nor should you expect me to agree with you.
I am tolerant. Tolerance is a two-way street.

]]> By: Jessica http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2008/12/08/7159/comment-page-1#comment-27318 Jessica Thu, 11 Dec 2008 06:31:47 +0000 http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=7159#comment-27318 Justin, do you consider that your need to form a family with a women is just a tendency. I don't think that you do. How is it that you can understand the people atracted to same-sex doesn't just have a tendency to love one another, the same need to marry and dedicate their life to one another is real among homosexual couples. The sin is ingnore their needs. Out of all the churches, the mother of the poligamous churches has come in defense of marrige. between a man an a woman...eventhough it believes that in heaven this man will have more wifes. I think that the tendency to desire more than one wife destroy more de ideal of marrige and put women in a position that God have never intended for his daughters. I was active in the church, married and served a mission. I use to be proud of being a member. Now I want my name out of the church record, Justin, do you consider that your need to form a family with a women is just a tendency. I don’t think that you do. How is it that you can understand the people atracted to same-sex doesn’t just have a tendency to love one another, the same need to marry and dedicate their life to one another is real among homosexual couples. The sin is ingnore their needs. Out of all the churches, the mother of the poligamous churches has come in defense of marrige. between a man an a woman…eventhough it believes that in heaven this man will have more wifes. I think that the tendency to desire more than one wife destroy more de ideal of marrige and put women in a position that God have never intended for his daughters. I was active in the church, married and served a mission. I use to be proud of being a member. Now I want my name out of the church record,

]]> By: cowboy http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2008/12/08/7159/comment-page-1#comment-27150 cowboy Wed, 10 Dec 2008 02:13:50 +0000 http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=7159#comment-27150 Mr. Bell, Is your attraction to a woman a “tendency”? Why would you think my attraction to a man is a "tendency"? My homosexuality is not a sin. It's a gift. Do me a favor and respect the trait I have been given. It's not a choice or an affliction. I like who I am. I'm perfectly happy with being attracted to males. I think your Brother is reaching out to you. I would suggest you first wish the blessings of peace and happiness when your Brother finds someone to share his life with. It's hard enough to try to find someone let alone having family fight against you. Mr. Bell,

Is your attraction to a woman a “tendency”? Why would you think my attraction to a man is a “tendency”?

My homosexuality is not a sin. It’s a gift. Do me a favor and respect the trait I have been given. It’s not a choice or an affliction. I like who I am. I’m perfectly happy with being attracted to males.

I think your Brother is reaching out to you. I would suggest you first wish the blessings of peace and happiness when your Brother finds someone to share his life with. It’s hard enough to try to find someone let alone having family fight against you.

]]> By: Rick http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2008/12/08/7159/comment-page-1#comment-27142 Rick Wed, 10 Dec 2008 01:02:30 +0000 http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=7159#comment-27142 Justin, The APA disagrees with you: http://www.apa.org/pi/sexual.html And the AMA also disagrees with you: http://www.ama-assn.org/ama/pub/category/14754.html#B-1.50 Homosexuality is not an affliction. You may feel it is immoral according to your religion; but it is not an illness. Justin,

The APA disagrees with you:

http://www.apa.org/pi/sexual.html

And the AMA also disagrees with you:

http://www.ama-assn.org/ama/pub/category/14754.html#B-1.50

Homosexuality is not an affliction. You may feel it is immoral according to your religion; but it is not an illness.

]]> By: Lisa Marie Potter http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2008/12/08/7159/comment-page-1#comment-27141 Lisa Marie Potter Wed, 10 Dec 2008 00:57:12 +0000 http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=7159#comment-27141 BYU remains so VERY BYU. Ivory tower residents, holier than thou attitudes. The world is their campus? HA HA! The campus is their world. BYU remains so VERY BYU. Ivory tower residents, holier than thou attitudes. The world is their campus? HA HA! The campus is their world.

]]> By: Justin Bell http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2008/12/08/7159/comment-page-1#comment-27137 Justin Bell Wed, 10 Dec 2008 00:31:20 +0000 http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=7159#comment-27137 If anybody reading this actually believes that The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints is true, and that it's leadership is inspired of God, you have a responsibility to study and pray until you finally see the wisdom in The Church's push for to make same-sex marriage illegal. There's a good reason for it. It's has nothing to do with bigotry. My heart goes out to anybody who has homosexual tendencies, no doubt I know someone and never would guess it. That is an incredibly tough affliction to deal with. There is help, you don't have to give in to temptation. The atonement is real and has the strength to support all. Christ met you. He met you personally and knows exactly what you are going through. My love to all, especially to my brother who sent me this link. If anybody reading this actually believes that The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints is true, and that it’s leadership is inspired of God, you have a responsibility to study and pray until you finally see the wisdom in The Church’s push for to make same-sex marriage illegal.
There’s a good reason for it. It’s has nothing to do with bigotry.
My heart goes out to anybody who has homosexual tendencies, no doubt I know someone and never would guess it. That is an incredibly tough affliction to deal with. There is help, you don’t have to give in to temptation. The atonement is real and has the strength to support all.
Christ met you. He met you personally and knows exactly what you are going through.
My love to all, especially to my brother who sent me this link.

]]> By: cowboy http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2008/12/08/7159/comment-page-1#comment-27116 cowboy Tue, 09 Dec 2008 22:35:12 +0000 http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=7159#comment-27116 You wonder what kind of “world” BYU graduates graduate into. Their little world is much like their campus and the surrounding, provincial village called Provo… A few years ago BYU had the traveling Rodin exhibit at its brand-new art museum. But BYU wouldn’t show “The Kiss” statue. They relegated it to the basement of the museum and the Provo City mayor’s wife made sure no school-aged children visiting the museum would be allowed to view the statue. This, mind you, is at a University. (**If you’re curious, do a wikipedia to see what Rodin <b>The Kiss</b> statue looks like. Hardly the kind of art that would offend even the most prudish. And this is what was shielded from the University and its community.) You wonder what kind of “world” BYU graduates graduate into.

Their little world is much like their campus and the surrounding, provincial village called Provo…

A few years ago BYU had the traveling Rodin exhibit at its brand-new art museum. But BYU wouldn’t show “The Kiss” statue. They relegated it to the basement of the museum and the Provo City mayor’s wife made sure no school-aged children visiting the museum would be allowed to view the statue.

This, mind you, is at a University.

(**If you’re curious, do a wikipedia to see what Rodin The Kiss statue looks like. Hardly the kind of art that would offend even the most prudish. And this is what was shielded from the University and its community.)

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