You want to portray Warren in the worst possible light; to that end it is best for you to think of him in the worst possible way.

That’s just another way of saying he considers incestuous and pedophilic marriages to be the equivalent of gay marriages – you’ve just conceded the point.

He was not asked if child molestation and incest were the same as gay marriage. Following up on his statement, he was asked if adult-child marriage and sibling marriage were equivalent to same-sex marriage. It was that question he answered yes.

It was a foolish thing for him to say, but you shouldn’t criticise him for saying more than he actually said. Given the context of the discussion — marriage and marriage laws — it was obvious that Warren meant that all four of these marriage forms, same-sex, sibling, adult-child, and polygamous, represent equally bad changes in our country’s marriage laws. Nothing he said indicates he considers polygamy to be the moral equivalent of child rape and incest, let alone that he considers gay couples to be so equivalent.

There is a difference between objecting to changing marriage laws to allow same-sex marriages as much as you object to changes that allow sibling marriages, and comparing gay relationships to incest. Warren explicitly did the former and not the latter. This is my entire point.

Gay activist often read a far more damning intent into their critics words than was actually present. Conservative Christian activists do the same to gays. It’s not a good thing.

Steven Waldman:Do you think, Do you think, though, that they are equivalent to having gays getting married?

Rick Warren: Oh I do.

He was asked point blank if child molestation, incest and polygamy were equivalent to gay marriage, and Warren said quite simply, I do. You may wish to believe that “I do” means something else, but I really don’t see how he could have been any clearer. “I do” is as clear as it gets.

I would have to agree with Timothy that Dave just wants to be contrarian by making up distinctions where none exist and going round and round on it. He has done this on so many threads. It isn’t even really challenging; it is just tiresome.

I simply do not see any good in going beyond exactly what was said to give the man’s words the worst possible interpretation. The only purpose that can possibly serve is to make dialogue with the opposing side impossible.

I was well aware of the exchange between Warren and Waldman you now quote. It doesn’t tell us anything other than Warren considers same-sex marriage to be as bad for society as those other three forms of marriage.

As I insinuated above, you are being disingenuous.

You are splitting hairs and making distinctions where none exist. I’ve no idea about your motivation for arguing this point, but I suspect it is simply a matter of being contrarian.

And just to set the record straight:

it is wrong to say he is saying that these four marriage forms are morally equivalent.

Oh? Then I guess you disagree with Rev. Warren about exactly what he meant:

Steven Waldman: Do you think, though, that [having a brother and sister be together and call that marriage; an older guy marrying a child and calling that a marriage; and one guy having multiple wives and calling that marriage] are equivalent to having gays getting married?

Rick Warren: Oh I do.

Absent any other discussion of these tyrants, one would have to believe that I was equating you to Hitler, Stalin and Nero. It would be disingenuous to suggest that I was just discussing various people with whom I disagreed.

Actually, since you are discussing rulers, you’d be suggesting that my public policies, or proposals for governmental policy, are as undesirable — at least for our country — as those rulers actions were.

One has to make a leap in logic to assume you consider all three dictators as morally equivalent, let alone that I am “no different morally” than they.

Jim said that Warren considers the love lives of his gay friends to be morally equivalent to “child rape, incest, or polygamy.” Warren never said that, nor was it directly implied by what he said.

Warren was discussing forms of marriage he considers undesirable for society. What he clearly meant is he considers changing the institution of marriage to allow same-sex marriages to be as bad for society as allowing sibling marriages, child marriages, or polygamous marriages.

You may strongly disagree with his opinion, but it is wrong to say he is saying that these four marriage forms are morally equivalent. To go even further and say Warren considers all gay relationships to be as bad as incest or child molesting is simply absurd.