<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: Mormons Unleash New Ad Against Washington&#8217;s Ref 71</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2009/10/07/15262/feed" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2009/10/07/15262</link>
	<description>News, analysis and fact-checking of anti-gay rhetoric</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sun, 12 Feb 2012 12:29:45 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0.4</generator>
	<item>
		<title>By: Jason Drew</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2009/10/07/15262/comment-page-1#comment-110652</link>
		<dc:creator>Jason Drew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Nov 2011 21:08:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=15262#comment-110652</guid>
		<description>&lt;strong&gt;Jason Drew...&lt;/strong&gt;

Major thanks for the article post. Keep writing....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong>Jason Drew&#8230;</strong></p>
<p>Major thanks for the article post. Keep writing&#8230;.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: TheColu.mn &#187; Blog Archive &#187; The National: Obama Throws Us a Bone. But Will He Clean His Plate of Campaign Promises?</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2009/10/07/15262/comment-page-1#comment-51135</link>
		<dc:creator>TheColu.mn &#187; Blog Archive &#187; The National: Obama Throws Us a Bone. But Will He Clean His Plate of Campaign Promises?</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Oct 2009 18:36:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=15262#comment-51135</guid>
		<description>[...] group Protect Marriage Washington as part of their push against same-gender marriage in Washington makes heavy use of imagery copyrighted by the Mormon Church. (Box Turtle [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] group Protect Marriage Washington as part of their push against same-gender marriage in Washington makes heavy use of imagery copyrighted by the Mormon Church. (Box Turtle [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Jessica Sideways</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2009/10/07/15262/comment-page-1#comment-51130</link>
		<dc:creator>Jessica Sideways</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Oct 2009 17:14:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=15262#comment-51130</guid>
		<description>I think that the morons should have their tax exempt status revoked solely for their continued direct disrespect of the rules surrounding that status. Not just the fact that they are being homophobic pricks...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think that the morons should have their tax exempt status revoked solely for their continued direct disrespect of the rules surrounding that status. Not just the fact that they are being homophobic pricks&#8230;</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Benjamin</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2009/10/07/15262/comment-page-1#comment-51126</link>
		<dc:creator>Benjamin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Oct 2009 16:49:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=15262#comment-51126</guid>
		<description>Another point about the Mormon church is that this &quot;one man and one woman&quot; issue is sadly ignoring the Church&#039;s distant past wherein 6 of its original prophets and many other early leaders practiced &quot;plural marriage&quot; or &quot;polygamy&quot; wherein one man had many wives.  Brigham Young also speculated that Adam brought Eve &quot;one of his wives&quot; with him into the Garden of Eden.  The LDS Church is afraid of this change yet they don&#039;t admit the fact that the Church has a decent presence in other countries who have full same sex marriage equality. Canada is one of those countries and yet their temples and their churches are doing just fine.  Also Boston, Massachusetts has a large Mormon Temple and that temple and the members of the various congregations throughout Massachusetts are fairing very well in a state that has legalized same sex marriage for years now.  The more states that pass same sex marriage into law the more their arguments will be irrelevant to most Americans.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Another point about the Mormon church is that this &#8220;one man and one woman&#8221; issue is sadly ignoring the Church&#8217;s distant past wherein 6 of its original prophets and many other early leaders practiced &#8220;plural marriage&#8221; or &#8220;polygamy&#8221; wherein one man had many wives.  Brigham Young also speculated that Adam brought Eve &#8220;one of his wives&#8221; with him into the Garden of Eden.  The LDS Church is afraid of this change yet they don&#8217;t admit the fact that the Church has a decent presence in other countries who have full same sex marriage equality. Canada is one of those countries and yet their temples and their churches are doing just fine.  Also Boston, Massachusetts has a large Mormon Temple and that temple and the members of the various congregations throughout Massachusetts are fairing very well in a state that has legalized same sex marriage for years now.  The more states that pass same sex marriage into law the more their arguments will be irrelevant to most Americans.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Benjamin</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2009/10/07/15262/comment-page-1#comment-51124</link>
		<dc:creator>Benjamin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Oct 2009 16:36:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=15262#comment-51124</guid>
		<description>I am opposed to what the LDS Church is doing in fighting the right of gay people (including myself) to get married to the person we love.  What they have done and are doing is wrong and they will sorely regret it if they don&#039;t change their approach toward us and our rights as LGBT people.

In all fairness to the teachings that the LDS Church teaches about Adam and Eve this &quot;fallible God hint&quot; or &quot;at least a God who gives conflicting instructions&quot; is based in a great deal of ignorance about LDS doctrine.  The LDS concept of the choices given in the garden are pretty progressive in that they do not blame Eve for making a &quot;bad&quot; or &quot;sinful&quot; choice.  In fact they teach &quot;she did what had to be done.  Adam was wise enough to do likewise.&quot; Apostle Russel M. Nelson.  They teach that there were two choices Adam and Eve were given.  They could either remain in the garden and be as little children forever (being immature and innocent not knowing good and evil);or they could partake of the fruit, experience a separation from God and experience an opposition in all things.  That is to go out of the garden into a fallen world to learn, to grow and to be strengthened by the experience, the riggers, the pain and the joy and difficulties of a fallen world. In other words they would have to work hard.  They would become independent adults who could choose, make mistakes and learn from them.  That&#039;s a universe away from the traditional Catholic and Protestant teachings that tend to view Eve as evil and Adam as pretty dumb to follow that woman into &quot;sin&quot;.

Some Jewish leaders have a very similar belief about the garden of Eden and the choices placed before Eve and Adam.  Rabbi Harold S. Kushner&#039;s best selling book How Good Do We Have To Be? A New Understanding of Guilt and Forgiveness is an excellent example of this and supports the Mormon teaching that Adam and Eve&#039;s fall was actually a good and necessary thing.

Where the Mormon Church has failed it&#039;s LGBT members is through instilling guilt, shame and fear about the great God given gift of our sexual orientation.  They have failed society in the way they have sought to impose that fear, guilt and shame on the greater society regarding all LGBT people.  This is a travesty and a terrible thing that needs to be corrected as they have truly gotten way off track in this area and they are extremely stubborn about it without any consideration to the painful and terrible effect their imposition is having on others.  We need to arm and equip ourselves with facts and understanding our opposition is a crucial part of this.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am opposed to what the LDS Church is doing in fighting the right of gay people (including myself) to get married to the person we love.  What they have done and are doing is wrong and they will sorely regret it if they don&#8217;t change their approach toward us and our rights as LGBT people.</p>
<p>In all fairness to the teachings that the LDS Church teaches about Adam and Eve this &#8220;fallible God hint&#8221; or &#8220;at least a God who gives conflicting instructions&#8221; is based in a great deal of ignorance about LDS doctrine.  The LDS concept of the choices given in the garden are pretty progressive in that they do not blame Eve for making a &#8220;bad&#8221; or &#8220;sinful&#8221; choice.  In fact they teach &#8220;she did what had to be done.  Adam was wise enough to do likewise.&#8221; Apostle Russel M. Nelson.  They teach that there were two choices Adam and Eve were given.  They could either remain in the garden and be as little children forever (being immature and innocent not knowing good and evil);or they could partake of the fruit, experience a separation from God and experience an opposition in all things.  That is to go out of the garden into a fallen world to learn, to grow and to be strengthened by the experience, the riggers, the pain and the joy and difficulties of a fallen world. In other words they would have to work hard.  They would become independent adults who could choose, make mistakes and learn from them.  That&#8217;s a universe away from the traditional Catholic and Protestant teachings that tend to view Eve as evil and Adam as pretty dumb to follow that woman into &#8220;sin&#8221;.</p>
<p>Some Jewish leaders have a very similar belief about the garden of Eden and the choices placed before Eve and Adam.  Rabbi Harold S. Kushner&#8217;s best selling book How Good Do We Have To Be? A New Understanding of Guilt and Forgiveness is an excellent example of this and supports the Mormon teaching that Adam and Eve&#8217;s fall was actually a good and necessary thing.</p>
<p>Where the Mormon Church has failed it&#8217;s LGBT members is through instilling guilt, shame and fear about the great God given gift of our sexual orientation.  They have failed society in the way they have sought to impose that fear, guilt and shame on the greater society regarding all LGBT people.  This is a travesty and a terrible thing that needs to be corrected as they have truly gotten way off track in this area and they are extremely stubborn about it without any consideration to the painful and terrible effect their imposition is having on others.  We need to arm and equip ourselves with facts and understanding our opposition is a crucial part of this.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Johnson</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2009/10/07/15262/comment-page-1#comment-51119</link>
		<dc:creator>Johnson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Oct 2009 15:52:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=15262#comment-51119</guid>
		<description>Who knew Eve had a Farrah Fawcett &#039;do and Adam sported a blow-dried late 70&#039;s haircut?  And why no mention of the gay hairdressers in the Garden who created them???</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Who knew Eve had a Farrah Fawcett &#8216;do and Adam sported a blow-dried late 70&#8242;s haircut?  And why no mention of the gay hairdressers in the Garden who created them???</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: David C.</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2009/10/07/15262/comment-page-1#comment-51099</link>
		<dc:creator>David C.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Oct 2009 04:53:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=15262#comment-51099</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt; Another reason this ad is a TOTAL lie is that Ref. 71 is about &lt;B&gt;DOMESTIC PARTNERSHIP&lt;/B&gt;, NOT “marriage”!

“They Lie!”&lt;i&gt; ---Eddie89&lt;/i&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;

But you see, this is what the LDS types &lt;B&gt;absolutely do not want:&lt;/B&gt; something that in any way could substitute for marriage, irrespective of whether you are gay or straight, but in particular if you happen to be gay.   
 
By now everybody has figured out that all the nonsense about the use of the word &lt;I&gt;marriage&lt;/I&gt; is just a ruse. These people &lt;b&gt;do not&lt;/b&gt; want you to have the protections afforded by the body of law associated with marriage if you are gay, &lt;i&gt;no matter what the institution or contract is called&lt;/i&gt;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p> Another reason this ad is a TOTAL lie is that Ref. 71 is about <b>DOMESTIC PARTNERSHIP</b>, NOT “marriage”!</p>
<p>“They Lie!”<i> &#8212;Eddie89</i></p></blockquote>
<p>But you see, this is what the LDS types <b>absolutely do not want:</b> something that in any way could substitute for marriage, irrespective of whether you are gay or straight, but in particular if you happen to be gay.   </p>
<p>By now everybody has figured out that all the nonsense about the use of the word <i>marriage</i> is just a ruse. These people <b>do not</b> want you to have the protections afforded by the body of law associated with marriage if you are gay, <i>no matter what the institution or contract is called</i>.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Cole</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2009/10/07/15262/comment-page-1#comment-51097</link>
		<dc:creator>Cole</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Oct 2009 03:48:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=15262#comment-51097</guid>
		<description>Remember the heterosexual-only marriage/ domestic partnership supporters barely collected enough signatures to get this referendum on the ballot (and election officials accepted tens of thousands of illegal signatures) yet here we are with virtually a tie.  I would bet that almost all of the &quot;undecided&quot; are in the reject the new domestic partnership column.  What have gay people in Washington done?  There was only one gay person who went out and filmed the deceptive tactics used to get people to sign the petition which if you remember had 30+ pages shrunk down to four (you can bet than NONE of those people that signed the petition even read it).  Only a few more days before voters get their ballots and gay people have done barely anything?  Go talk to Washington voters, phonebank (you can do that from home anywhere), twitter, post videos online, write to Washington newspapers etc.
APPROVE Referendum 71
http://tinyurl.com/poc4h5</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Remember the heterosexual-only marriage/ domestic partnership supporters barely collected enough signatures to get this referendum on the ballot (and election officials accepted tens of thousands of illegal signatures) yet here we are with virtually a tie.  I would bet that almost all of the &#8220;undecided&#8221; are in the reject the new domestic partnership column.  What have gay people in Washington done?  There was only one gay person who went out and filmed the deceptive tactics used to get people to sign the petition which if you remember had 30+ pages shrunk down to four (you can bet than NONE of those people that signed the petition even read it).  Only a few more days before voters get their ballots and gay people have done barely anything?  Go talk to Washington voters, phonebank (you can do that from home anywhere), twitter, post videos online, write to Washington newspapers etc.<br />
APPROVE Referendum 71<br />
<a href="http://tinyurl.com/poc4h5" rel="nofollow">http://tinyurl.com/poc4h5</a></p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Edwin</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2009/10/07/15262/comment-page-1#comment-51094</link>
		<dc:creator>Edwin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Oct 2009 01:41:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=15262#comment-51094</guid>
		<description>So when is this religion going to lose it&#039;e tax exemption status.  all this money just to try to screw up other peoples lives.
  Why don&#039;t they just stay in utah and leave real people alone?  We only want the same rights that everybody else takes for granted.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So when is this religion going to lose it&#8217;e tax exemption status.  all this money just to try to screw up other peoples lives.<br />
  Why don&#8217;t they just stay in utah and leave real people alone?  We only want the same rights that everybody else takes for granted.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Leonard Drake</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2009/10/07/15262/comment-page-1#comment-51090</link>
		<dc:creator>Leonard Drake</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Oct 2009 01:16:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=15262#comment-51090</guid>
		<description>Patrick, in addition to your points about &quot;God&quot; and &quot;man,&quot; I just loved the picture of Jesus Christ when the 3rd (or so) reference to &quot;God&quot; is mentioned. What a narrow mindset. I am sure that really pleased those people of Jewish, Muslim and other faiths. (not)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Patrick, in addition to your points about &#8220;God&#8221; and &#8220;man,&#8221; I just loved the picture of Jesus Christ when the 3rd (or so) reference to &#8220;God&#8221; is mentioned. What a narrow mindset. I am sure that really pleased those people of Jewish, Muslim and other faiths. (not)</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>

