Comments on: Cowboy Museum looks at gay and transgender folk in the wild west http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2009/12/16/18313 News, analysis and fact-checking of anti-gay rhetoric Sun, 12 Feb 2012 15:03:18 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0.4 By: alanschultz http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2009/12/16/18313/comment-page-1#comment-57283 alanschultz Fri, 18 Dec 2009 00:58:09 +0000 http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=18313#comment-57283 Unknown to most, the real cow "BOYS" were Black men fleeing slavery in the south and going west. Blacks were often called "BOYS" thus the word cowboy. A more historical museum would be to visit the Black Cowboy Museum in Denver, Colorado. (Not sure if that is the correct name) fascinating place and probably depicts the real cowboys better. Unknown to most, the real cow “BOYS” were Black men fleeing slavery in the south and going west. Blacks were often called “BOYS” thus the word cowboy. A more historical museum would be to visit the Black Cowboy Museum in Denver, Colorado. (Not sure if that is the correct name) fascinating place and probably depicts the real cowboys better.

]]> By: John Trudell http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2009/12/16/18313/comment-page-1#comment-57257 John Trudell Thu, 17 Dec 2009 20:06:33 +0000 http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=18313#comment-57257 If it was implied, it wasn't implied by Jim. A lot of what was said during the interview didn't make it into the final copy. We have many Christians on the Ultimate Brokeback Forum where Jim is a member. It's a topic we've been discussing for 4 years. If it was implied, it wasn’t implied by Jim.

A lot of what was said during the interview didn’t make it into the final copy.

We have many Christians on the Ultimate Brokeback Forum where Jim is a member.

It’s a topic we’ve been discussing for 4 years.

]]> By: cowboy http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2009/12/16/18313/comment-page-1#comment-57256 cowboy Thu, 17 Dec 2009 19:58:05 +0000 http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=18313#comment-57256 My experience with gay/straight rodeos can be rather stereotypical. Sometimes you have to defend doing barrel racing (which is strictly a female event at “normal” rodeos) but I was proud to know our one-time champion bull rider (and local sheriff/forest ranger) was a petite woman. There aren’t many in the main-stream rodeo circuit who know we have steer-wrestling for both genders. If I get any flack from anyone I just introduce them to Debbie. [Tip hat] mikekSF Oh...okay John T. maybe it was a bit implied. My experience with gay/straight rodeos can be rather stereotypical. Sometimes you have to defend doing barrel racing (which is strictly a female event at “normal” rodeos) but I was proud to know our one-time champion bull rider (and local sheriff/forest ranger) was a petite woman. There aren’t many in the main-stream rodeo circuit who know we have steer-wrestling for both genders. If I get any flack from anyone I just introduce them to Debbie.

[Tip hat] mikekSF

Oh…okay John T. maybe it was a bit implied.

]]> By: Timothy Kincaid http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2009/12/16/18313/comment-page-1#comment-57255 Timothy Kincaid Thu, 17 Dec 2009 19:58:03 +0000 http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=18313#comment-57255 <blockquote>That’s making an assumption all Christians are anti-gay and all gays are anti-Christian doesn’t it?</blockquote> Not necessarily. As a gay Christian, I would probably feel uncomfortable in a rodeo group's Bible study. This is a pretty conservative community (cursin', carousin', drinkin' and cheatin' notwithstanding) and I think that if social issues arose in such a setting that I would either have to bite my tongue or get confrontational. People who are otherwise friendly and polite can find themselves feeling perfectly justified in saying the most offensive things if they they are in a religious setting.

That’s making an assumption all Christians are anti-gay and all gays are anti-Christian doesn’t it?

Not necessarily. As a gay Christian, I would probably feel uncomfortable in a rodeo group’s Bible study. This is a pretty conservative community (cursin’, carousin’, drinkin’ and cheatin’ notwithstanding) and I think that if social issues arose in such a setting that I would either have to bite my tongue or get confrontational.

People who are otherwise friendly and polite can find themselves feeling perfectly justified in saying the most offensive things if they they are in a religious setting.

]]> By: John Trudell http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2009/12/16/18313/comment-page-1#comment-57254 John Trudell Thu, 17 Dec 2009 19:51:43 +0000 http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=18313#comment-57254 Jim's comment in the article uses the words "sometimes" and "some", not "always" and "all". So no, there isn't an assumption that all Christians are anti-gay and all gays are anti-Christian . Jim’s comment in the article uses the words “sometimes” and “some”, not “always” and “all”.

So no, there isn’t an assumption that all Christians are anti-gay and all gays are anti-Christian .

]]> By: mikeksf http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2009/12/16/18313/comment-page-1#comment-57245 mikeksf Thu, 17 Dec 2009 19:10:59 +0000 http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=18313#comment-57245 Cowboy.. Yup, Pardner, it sure 'nough does Cowboy..
Yup, Pardner, it sure ‘nough does

]]> By: cowboy http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2009/12/16/18313/comment-page-1#comment-57241 cowboy Thu, 17 Dec 2009 18:30:11 +0000 http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=18313#comment-57241 From the referenced LA Times article: <blockquote>But, [James Pluth (active in gay rodeos)] said that straight rodeo groups sometimes engage in Christian activities, such as group prayer and Bible study, that may make some gay participants feel uncomfortable. </blockquote> That’s making an assumption all Christians are anti-gay and all gays are anti-Christian doesn’t it? From the referenced LA Times article:

But, [James Pluth (active in gay rodeos)] said that straight rodeo groups sometimes engage in Christian activities, such as group prayer and Bible study, that may make some gay participants feel uncomfortable.

That’s making an assumption all Christians are anti-gay and all gays are anti-Christian doesn’t it?

]]> By: Ephilei http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2009/12/16/18313/comment-page-1#comment-57236 Ephilei Thu, 17 Dec 2009 17:56:00 +0000 http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=18313#comment-57236 Transgender people (even people going under the knife) have been around for thousands of years. Eunuchs. Hijras. It makes sense for transfolk to have manifested in the Wild West where there was lots of alone time and not worrying about what culture thought, not to mention no cross dressing laws. Transpeople will thrive where cultural taboos are weak. Transgender people (even people going under the knife) have been around for thousands of years. Eunuchs. Hijras. It makes sense for transfolk to have manifested in the Wild West where there was lots of alone time and not worrying about what culture thought, not to mention no cross dressing laws. Transpeople will thrive where cultural taboos are weak.

]]> By: Bruce Garrett http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2009/12/16/18313/comment-page-1#comment-57215 Bruce Garrett Thu, 17 Dec 2009 15:47:54 +0000 http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=18313#comment-57215 If you ever get your hands on William Dale Jennings' book, <i>The Cowboys</i>, give a scan to the absolutely fascinating "Western Glossery" he attached to the end of it. Jennings, himself a pioneer in the modern gay rights movement, clearly did a lot of research and picked up on things that perhaps heterosexual historians of the period were either blind to, or just didn't want to notice. Here's one entry, just to give you a taste: <blockquote><i>Bunkie</i>, or <i>Bunky:</i> Bedmate. Possibly related to "bunky", a horse that pitches. Though which came first is the question.</blockquote> Beyond the notice of terms that could clearly be taken as homoerotic double-entendre when you looked at them more carefully, there are a lot of delightful western slang terms such as "Coffin Varnish" for whiskey and "Live on the jawbone" for living on credit and "Ankle Express" for when circumstances force you to walk rather then ride. You're told that "Eating grass" is one of 31 terms the cowboy had for being thrown from a horse. The book is vastly better then the John Wayne movie made from it, mostly for all these little details of cowboy life. If you ever get your hands on William Dale Jennings’ book, The Cowboys, give a scan to the absolutely fascinating “Western Glossery” he attached to the end of it. Jennings, himself a pioneer in the modern gay rights movement, clearly did a lot of research and picked up on things that perhaps heterosexual historians of the period were either blind to, or just didn’t want to notice. Here’s one entry, just to give you a taste:

Bunkie, or Bunky: Bedmate. Possibly related to “bunky”, a horse that pitches. Though which came first is the question.

Beyond the notice of terms that could clearly be taken as homoerotic double-entendre when you looked at them more carefully, there are a lot of delightful western slang terms such as “Coffin Varnish” for whiskey and “Live on the jawbone” for living on credit and “Ankle Express” for when circumstances force you to walk rather then ride. You’re told that “Eating grass” is one of 31 terms the cowboy had for being thrown from a horse. The book is vastly better then the John Wayne movie made from it, mostly for all these little details of cowboy life.

]]> By: Jason D http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2009/12/16/18313/comment-page-1#comment-57214 Jason D Thu, 17 Dec 2009 15:21:13 +0000 http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=18313#comment-57214 Jafuf, transgender is not exactly new, it was popularized in the 1970's and become something of an umbrella term in the 1980's. Jafuf, transgender is not exactly new, it was popularized in the 1970′s and become something of an umbrella term in the 1980′s.

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