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	<title>Comments on: NOM in St. Paul: a disturbing perversion of Christianity</title>
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	<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/07/28/24758</link>
	<description>News, analysis and fact-checking of anti-gay rhetoric</description>
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		<title>By: Priya Lynn</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/07/28/24758/comment-page-1#comment-73981</link>
		<dc:creator>Priya Lynn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Jul 2010 15:57:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=24758#comment-73981</guid>
		<description>I know as an atheist it shouldn&#039;t matter to me, but I find it despicable when evangelicals preach that Catholics are going to hell and the pope is the anti-christ.  Within a christian framework that&#039;s absurd.  It surprises me that evangelicals are so bigoted to their fellow christians and makes me think much less of them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I know as an atheist it shouldn&#8217;t matter to me, but I find it despicable when evangelicals preach that Catholics are going to hell and the pope is the anti-christ.  Within a christian framework that&#8217;s absurd.  It surprises me that evangelicals are so bigoted to their fellow christians and makes me think much less of them.</p>
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		<title>By: wendy leigh</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/07/28/24758/comment-page-1#comment-73973</link>
		<dc:creator>wendy leigh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Jul 2010 15:17:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=24758#comment-73973</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ve said for a long time that the issue of abortion is about preserving white birth numbers, and it is spoken about quite openly on other continents. 
Father Becker used the same schpeel at our conference committee hearing. 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sK-OxOZ6XkQ&amp;NR=1</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve said for a long time that the issue of abortion is about preserving white birth numbers, and it is spoken about quite openly on other continents.<br />
Father Becker used the same schpeel at our conference committee hearing.<br />
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sK-OxOZ6XkQ&#038;NR=1" rel="nofollow">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sK-OxOZ6XkQ&#038;NR=1</a></p>
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		<title>By: Richard Rush</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/07/28/24758/comment-page-1#comment-73955</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Rush</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Jul 2010 13:30:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=24758#comment-73955</guid>
		<description>&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1210519/Never-mind-pillow-talk-couples-told-Roman-Catholic-church-PRAY-sex.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;&lt;b&gt;Catholic church issues prayer for faithful to say before sex&lt;/b&gt;&lt;/a&gt;

&lt;blockquote&gt;Roman Catholic couples are being encouraged to pray together before they have sex.

A book published by a prominent Church group invites those setting out on married life to recite the specially-composed Prayer Before Making Love. 

It is aimed at &#039;purifying their intentions&#039; so that the act is not about selfishness or hedonism . . .&lt;/blockquote&gt;

The article even includes a how-to photo.

As a part of comprehensive sex education, I believe our children need to learn exactly what it means when Dad says to Mom, &quot;Let us Pray.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1210519/Never-mind-pillow-talk-couples-told-Roman-Catholic-church-PRAY-sex.html" rel="nofollow"><b>Catholic church issues prayer for faithful to say before sex</b></a></p>
<blockquote><p>Roman Catholic couples are being encouraged to pray together before they have sex.</p>
<p>A book published by a prominent Church group invites those setting out on married life to recite the specially-composed Prayer Before Making Love. </p>
<p>It is aimed at &#8216;purifying their intentions&#8217; so that the act is not about selfishness or hedonism . . .</p></blockquote>
<p>The article even includes a how-to photo.</p>
<p>As a part of comprehensive sex education, I believe our children need to learn exactly what it means when Dad says to Mom, &#8220;Let us Pray.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: TampaZeke</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/07/28/24758/comment-page-1#comment-73942</link>
		<dc:creator>TampaZeke</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Jul 2010 02:05:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=24758#comment-73942</guid>
		<description>You know what?  Spiritual sex; prayerful sex; worship sex; pagan sex or just plain f*cking sex, I don&#039;t get my sex advice from middle aged men who have spent their whole adult life in celibacy or hiding and lying about their sex.

That makes as much sense as getting advice from a vegan on the best way to roast a pig or asking a lesbian for advice on jerking off.

Sorry to be crude but I find it fascinating that people go to PRIESTS for sex, marriage and relationship counseling.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You know what?  Spiritual sex; prayerful sex; worship sex; pagan sex or just plain f*cking sex, I don&#8217;t get my sex advice from middle aged men who have spent their whole adult life in celibacy or hiding and lying about their sex.</p>
<p>That makes as much sense as getting advice from a vegan on the best way to roast a pig or asking a lesbian for advice on jerking off.</p>
<p>Sorry to be crude but I find it fascinating that people go to PRIESTS for sex, marriage and relationship counseling.</p>
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		<title>By: Candace</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/07/28/24758/comment-page-1#comment-73939</link>
		<dc:creator>Candace</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Jul 2010 00:07:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=24758#comment-73939</guid>
		<description>So, I guess Fr. Becker doesn&#039;t pray much?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So, I guess Fr. Becker doesn&#8217;t pray much?</p>
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		<title>By: Jim Burroway</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/07/28/24758/comment-page-1#comment-73937</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim Burroway</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jul 2010 23:50:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=24758#comment-73937</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;anal and oral sex lack dignity because they abuse their partners as instrumentalities of pleasure for non-procreative potential.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

There ya go! It&#039;s all about procreative potential, although if I recall, the chatechism was okay with it as long as it was an act of foreplay &lt;em&gt;leading&lt;/em&gt; to &quot;procreative potential&quot;. So Fr. Becker is a bit off.

But yes, you can see the whole obsession over sex that is, well, strange and unhealthy, to say the least.

While the idea may be off-putting among some Protestants, the Catholic view of sex as prayer, I think, has some very attractive features from a spirituality standpoint. And from a more practical point of view, I offer my condolences to anyone who has never had the feeling of having been in the company of angels in the afterglow.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>anal and oral sex lack dignity because they abuse their partners as instrumentalities of pleasure for non-procreative potential.</p></blockquote>
<p>There ya go! It&#8217;s all about procreative potential, although if I recall, the chatechism was okay with it as long as it was an act of foreplay <em>leading</em> to &#8220;procreative potential&#8221;. So Fr. Becker is a bit off.</p>
<p>But yes, you can see the whole obsession over sex that is, well, strange and unhealthy, to say the least.</p>
<p>While the idea may be off-putting among some Protestants, the Catholic view of sex as prayer, I think, has some very attractive features from a spirituality standpoint. And from a more practical point of view, I offer my condolences to anyone who has never had the feeling of having been in the company of angels in the afterglow.</p>
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		<title>By: Jim Burroway</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/07/28/24758/comment-page-1#comment-73931</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim Burroway</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jul 2010 23:27:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=24758#comment-73931</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;I would get them bonding over “the Bible says its sin” and overlooking doctrinal differences. But the priests and Bishops they’ve had so far seem to be making NOM’s rallies all about Catholic doctrine.

Oh, hey, I feel another commentary coming on.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Bingo! :-) Once you ground social policy arguments in religious beliefs, then the next logical question is &lt;em&gt;whose&lt;/em&gt; religion should prevail!

That is why Catholics have historically been reluctant to enter into overt politics (and why most of the Catholic laity are still reluctant to do so). Historically, they were never on the winning end in the English-speaking world. 

So yes, NOM&#039;s very open Catholic-centrism is an odd thing to see. Imagine if the Mormons had put on a public rally in San Diego talking about Celestial marraiges?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>I would get them bonding over “the Bible says its sin” and overlooking doctrinal differences. But the priests and Bishops they’ve had so far seem to be making NOM’s rallies all about Catholic doctrine.</p>
<p>Oh, hey, I feel another commentary coming on.</p></blockquote>
<p>Bingo! :-) Once you ground social policy arguments in religious beliefs, then the next logical question is <em>whose</em> religion should prevail!</p>
<p>That is why Catholics have historically been reluctant to enter into overt politics (and why most of the Catholic laity are still reluctant to do so). Historically, they were never on the winning end in the English-speaking world. </p>
<p>So yes, NOM&#8217;s very open Catholic-centrism is an odd thing to see. Imagine if the Mormons had put on a public rally in San Diego talking about Celestial marraiges?</p>
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		<title>By: DN</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/07/28/24758/comment-page-1#comment-73927</link>
		<dc:creator>DN</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jul 2010 23:15:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=24758#comment-73927</guid>
		<description>I find it very interesting that in order to find out what NOM&#039;s speakers said at their rallies, I have to go to their opposition&#039;s websites.

I asked NOM in a blog comment (which, no surprise, was moderated into the digital garbage) why nobody from NOM is reporting on what their actual message is.

As to the content of this guy&#039;s message - utter tripe.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I find it very interesting that in order to find out what NOM&#8217;s speakers said at their rallies, I have to go to their opposition&#8217;s websites.</p>
<p>I asked NOM in a blog comment (which, no surprise, was moderated into the digital garbage) why nobody from NOM is reporting on what their actual message is.</p>
<p>As to the content of this guy&#8217;s message &#8211; utter tripe.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/07/28/24758/comment-page-1#comment-73923</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jul 2010 22:35:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=24758#comment-73923</guid>
		<description>The Catholic Church (and many others) seem to ignore one uncomfortable truth.  There are simply TOO MANY HUMANS on this planet. Global warming, all kinds of pollution, maldistribution of wealth, food shortages, fresh drinking water depletion, deforestation, urban sprawl, species extinction, and on and on are all due to one simple truth.  There are too many of us.  
So, what is the logic of the Catholic Church&#039;s teaching that all sex must be for procreation???
On one hand the Church condemns global warming and speaks about respecting the environment.  Yet they suggest that humans must continue to breed like rabbits and destroy this planet in the process.
The Catholic Church and many humans have the inflated idea that this earth was made only for us.  They also believe that all evolution must have stopped with us---we are the end all of all God ever wanted.
What garbage.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Catholic Church (and many others) seem to ignore one uncomfortable truth.  There are simply TOO MANY HUMANS on this planet. Global warming, all kinds of pollution, maldistribution of wealth, food shortages, fresh drinking water depletion, deforestation, urban sprawl, species extinction, and on and on are all due to one simple truth.  There are too many of us.<br />
So, what is the logic of the Catholic Church&#8217;s teaching that all sex must be for procreation???<br />
On one hand the Church condemns global warming and speaks about respecting the environment.  Yet they suggest that humans must continue to breed like rabbits and destroy this planet in the process.<br />
The Catholic Church and many humans have the inflated idea that this earth was made only for us.  They also believe that all evolution must have stopped with us&#8212;we are the end all of all God ever wanted.<br />
What garbage.</p>
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		<title>By: Emily K</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/07/28/24758/comment-page-1#comment-73921</link>
		<dc:creator>Emily K</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jul 2010 22:21:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=24758#comment-73921</guid>
		<description>On the contrary, Timothy, Jews see sex as a sacred act indeed. The Talmud has rather explicit explanations, interpretations, and writings about sex by Rabbis going back hundreds of years. To make love on Shabbat is even better than making love during a different day of the week!

I don&#039;t see anything wrong with thinking God was in the presence of the conception of her child. Isn&#039;t conceiving a child a often the product of a loving physical union? The problem lies in deifying a specific sexual act to the preclusion of all other sex acts.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>On the contrary, Timothy, Jews see sex as a sacred act indeed. The Talmud has rather explicit explanations, interpretations, and writings about sex by Rabbis going back hundreds of years. To make love on Shabbat is even better than making love during a different day of the week!</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t see anything wrong with thinking God was in the presence of the conception of her child. Isn&#8217;t conceiving a child a often the product of a loving physical union? The problem lies in deifying a specific sexual act to the preclusion of all other sex acts.</p>
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