Zeke said:

Some may argue that you stay in these churches and change them from the inside. I say NOTHING will change a church’s positions quicker than EMPTY pews and empty offering plates!

Alas, that won’t work. Nearly all denominations (including the United Methodist Church, of which I’m a lifelong member) have lost membership in the last half century, the UMC dropping from 10 million members to under 8 million. My own local church used to have over 200 worshipers on a Sunday morning. Now we are lucky to get 100. Does this get the church leadership to examine what we are doing wrong? Not at all.

For many in the UMC (and in many other denominations) the reaction to loss of membership is a feeling that if we only tried harder and remained steadfast in our message we would stop the exodus. Yeah, right.

There are two possible futures of the UMC. Die out, or change from inside. The conservative members and much of the leadership aren’t going to lead that change. It has to come from the gay members and their allies. It is good to see our allies are increasing in number. The vote in 2008 that kept the anti-gay policies was by the smallest margin yet.

I’m in a leadership position at my church and one of my goals is to get my own congregation to declare themselves welcoming to gay people (and blacks, and AA members…). Alas, so far the effort is going nowhere. They don’t argue with me. They have simply refused to discuss in the topic at all.

I’ve got a few more ways to get the discussion started, so I haven’t given up hope. We may soon live up to our motto of “Open Hearts, Open Minds, Open Doors.”

All of our delegates came back disheartened from the 2008 General Conference when the conservatives blocked the adoption of gay-friendly policies.

We’re not all bad, Zeke. Sometimes we have to work from the _inside_ to change policy.

I only briefly attended at UMC church because it was literally across the street from where I lived at the time and had a sign letting gay people know they were welcome. It was kinda sad; me, the pastor and his wife, and a few old women. Eventually it was too depressing and I went elsewhere.

But that church was more than just a Sunday service. It was also center where hot meals were prepared for AIDS patients in the entire Hollywood area. It had the largest AA and NA meetings. It was in use every day of the week and was everything that “Christian” is supposed to mean.

I also know that Hollywood Methodist (a different church) put up a giant AIDS ribbon on their church tower some 20+ years ago when other churches were saying that AIDS was a curse from God.

In my area, UMC is not being dragged slowing into the 21st century. They are marching ahead pulling others with them.

I am not so callous as to dismiss their efforts or to be unappreciative. I owe them more than that.

But I’m not interested in doing either. I am interested, however, in presenting factual information. I cannot with any sense of integrity accuse the UMC in CA of being anything other than a proactive ally for our community.

And I cannot look at international politics and blame Hollywood Methodist for how the African and Asian UMC members voted.

The world isn’t black and white and neither is religion. And while we’d all be more comfortable to just know who we are supposed to follow and who we are supposed to hate, I can’t go there. That way leads to dragons.

I used to be defensive like Timothy is on all thing Christian. Not any more.

It is what it is and no amount of make-up can cover the ugly truth.

This church that voted to allow a gay parishioner to be barred from attending one of their churches immediately launched a media blitz PR campaign with commercials extolling their claim that they were a church with,

“Open hearts, open doors and open minds”

Perhaps you misread the article. The church did NOT vote to allow a parishioner to be barred. In fact, they voted out the Judicial Council that made the decision.

And the reason people stay in a church is because they like it. People don’t attend a national church, they attend a local church. Their home congregation is full of people who love them, welcome them, and include them. They are not willing to abandon their faith family over what some church in Alabama did at the national convention – especially when they know that their own delegates fought for them.

And those who live in California, for example, don’t have a clue what you are talking about. The United Methodist Church’s northern and southern CA divisions voted to Oppose Proposition 8.

How about, “If you have offended someone, turn the other cheek.” The message there is that if you are hurting people, it is up to you to seek out how to make amends, not up to the person hurt to prove to you that you hurt them.

As I always like to put it: what part of “Judge Not lest ye be judged” does not apply to a good Christian such as yourself?

“Open hearts, open doors and open minds”

How insulting! Allowing a gay person to be barred from one of your churches does not demonstrate open hearts OR open doors OR open minds.

They would have been better off to NOT do the media blitz until AFTER they rectified this disgraceful ruling.