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	<title>Comments on: NOM&#8217;s Tour of Mostly-Empty City Plaza rolls to a stop</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/08/15/25445/feed" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/08/15/25445</link>
	<description>News, analysis and fact-checking of anti-gay rhetoric</description>
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		<title>By: majii</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/08/15/25445/comment-page-1#comment-75977</link>
		<dc:creator>majii</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Aug 2010 02:28:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=25445#comment-75977</guid>
		<description>&quot;I am determined to go all the way through. If it costs my life, I am determined, because I’ve got heaven in my view. If it means I have got to stand alone, if it means my friends be few, I am not worried about what people say. I’ve got heaven on my mind.&quot;

In many African American Baptist churches, this is a quote that I&#039;ve heard used many times before when someone wants to emphasize how dedicated he/she is to an issue.  

Fauntroy is playing to the crowd, putting on a show to entertain them.  He&#039;s as much of a hypocrite as Jackson, King, LaBarbera, and the rest of this delusional crew that operates to reinforce their insane positions on gay marriage.  Although they&#039;ll rail against LGBTQ folks, some of them are doing the same thing, like Rekers, Foley, and Haggard.

@the poster who said that he/she doesn&#039;t understand how/why the African American woman would be holding up a sign saying &quot;Let the People Vote&quot; in light of the history of AAs in this country.  All that I can say is that I don&#039;t understand how/why she could do it either.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;I am determined to go all the way through. If it costs my life, I am determined, because I’ve got heaven in my view. If it means I have got to stand alone, if it means my friends be few, I am not worried about what people say. I’ve got heaven on my mind.&#8221;</p>
<p>In many African American Baptist churches, this is a quote that I&#8217;ve heard used many times before when someone wants to emphasize how dedicated he/she is to an issue.  </p>
<p>Fauntroy is playing to the crowd, putting on a show to entertain them.  He&#8217;s as much of a hypocrite as Jackson, King, LaBarbera, and the rest of this delusional crew that operates to reinforce their insane positions on gay marriage.  Although they&#8217;ll rail against LGBTQ folks, some of them are doing the same thing, like Rekers, Foley, and Haggard.</p>
<p>@the poster who said that he/she doesn&#8217;t understand how/why the African American woman would be holding up a sign saying &#8220;Let the People Vote&#8221; in light of the history of AAs in this country.  All that I can say is that I don&#8217;t understand how/why she could do it either.</p>
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		<title>By: Timothy Kincaid</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/08/15/25445/comment-page-1#comment-75938</link>
		<dc:creator>Timothy Kincaid</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Aug 2010 17:39:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=25445#comment-75938</guid>
		<description>Bruce,

I&#039;m in Los Angeles and didn&#039;t experience any of NOM&#039;s tour.  I tried to compile info both from NOM and from Tour Tracker to give a synopsis of each stop.

My info is all second hand.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bruce,</p>
<p>I&#8217;m in Los Angeles and didn&#8217;t experience any of NOM&#8217;s tour.  I tried to compile info both from NOM and from Tour Tracker to give a synopsis of each stop.</p>
<p>My info is all second hand.</p>
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		<title>By: David C.</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/08/15/25445/comment-page-1#comment-75932</link>
		<dc:creator>David C.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Aug 2010 17:02:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=25445#comment-75932</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Time to return the favor by talking about protecting all families, and the way a well-heeled vocal minority of radicals activists is trying to harm our children.&lt;i&gt;&lt;b&gt;
—David&lt;/b&gt;&lt;/i&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
Obviously you get my point and your suggestion is a good one that should be used in our campaigning when next our rights are put up to a vote. I&#039;m sure others here can come up with more suggestions. 

One of my favorites is speaking clearly to the religious and explaining that &lt;i&gt;freedom of religion&lt;/i&gt; means a lot more than just selecting among the various flavors of Christianity, and &lt;i&gt;freedom of speech&lt;/i&gt; means something more than just parroting what we are told by right-wing talking heads and evangelicals quoting the Bible.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Time to return the favor by talking about protecting all families, and the way a well-heeled vocal minority of radicals activists is trying to harm our children.<i><b><br />
—David</b></i></p></blockquote>
<p>Obviously you get my point and your suggestion is a good one that should be used in our campaigning when next our rights are put up to a vote. I&#8217;m sure others here can come up with more suggestions. </p>
<p>One of my favorites is speaking clearly to the religious and explaining that <i>freedom of religion</i> means a lot more than just selecting among the various flavors of Christianity, and <i>freedom of speech</i> means something more than just parroting what we are told by right-wing talking heads and evangelicals quoting the Bible.</p>
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		<title>By: elaygee</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/08/15/25445/comment-page-1#comment-75921</link>
		<dc:creator>elaygee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Aug 2010 14:27:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=25445#comment-75921</guid>
		<description>If I&#039;d have been there, I would have read them the Bible chapters on how and where to get slaves and taken them all as my possessions just as the Bible declares. See how they like the Bible then.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If I&#8217;d have been there, I would have read them the Bible chapters on how and where to get slaves and taken them all as my possessions just as the Bible declares. See how they like the Bible then.</p>
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		<title>By: werdna</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/08/15/25445/comment-page-1#comment-75913</link>
		<dc:creator>werdna</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Aug 2010 09:58:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=25445#comment-75913</guid>
		<description>@ Emily K

Sadly Timothy is not the first to come up with &quot;&lt;a href=&quot;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adam_&amp;_Yves&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Adam and Yves&lt;/a&gt;&quot;. I am impressed with his knowledge of vintage gay porn, however!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ Emily K</p>
<p>Sadly Timothy is not the first to come up with &#8220;<a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adam_&amp;_Yves" rel="nofollow">Adam and Yves</a>&#8220;. I am impressed with his knowledge of vintage gay porn, however!</p>
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		<title>By: pepa</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/08/15/25445/comment-page-1#comment-75912</link>
		<dc:creator>pepa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Aug 2010 08:50:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=25445#comment-75912</guid>
		<description>The most memorable moment for me was when a NOM supporter held that unforgettable sign about &quot;the solution to gay marriage&quot; with two nooses and citing Leviticus. It inspired me to make a nice video about it which is in the link above.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The most memorable moment for me was when a NOM supporter held that unforgettable sign about &#8220;the solution to gay marriage&#8221; with two nooses and citing Leviticus. It inspired me to make a nice video about it which is in the link above.</p>
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		<title>By: David</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/08/15/25445/comment-page-1#comment-75910</link>
		<dc:creator>David</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Aug 2010 07:08:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=25445#comment-75910</guid>
		<description>&quot;The instant we gain traction with a particular idea, such as in this case drawing parallels between the black civil rights movement and our own struggle, our opponents immediately start to crank up their noise machine to distort and “jam” our message. &quot;

Time to return the favor by talking about protecting all families, and the way a well-heeled vocal minority of radicals activists is trying to harm our children.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;The instant we gain traction with a particular idea, such as in this case drawing parallels between the black civil rights movement and our own struggle, our opponents immediately start to crank up their noise machine to distort and “jam” our message. &#8221;</p>
<p>Time to return the favor by talking about protecting all families, and the way a well-heeled vocal minority of radicals activists is trying to harm our children.</p>
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		<title>By: David C.</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/08/15/25445/comment-page-1#comment-75907</link>
		<dc:creator>David C.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Aug 2010 05:31:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=25445#comment-75907</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;I’ve noticed that more and more right-wing fundamentalists are comparing their efforts to civil rights struggles. Is this a shallow attempt to appeal to African Americans, or to liberals of various races?&lt;i&gt;&lt;b&gt;—Ahab&lt;/b&gt;&lt;/i&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
This is a political tactic—attempt to co opt the terminology and tactics of your opponent. By confusing the meaning of the words and concepts they are intended to convey, our opponents seek to blunt the clearly obvious and logical case we are making for LGBT civil rights. 

Such techniques have a tendency to work in our modern times even more than they have in the past because of the rapid spread of information provided by 24-hour cable &quot;news&quot; and the large echo chamber provided by new media such as the Internet. It&#039;s an old technique though.

It also provides us with a hint. The instant we gain traction with a particular idea, such as in this case drawing parallels between the black civil rights movement and our own struggle, our opponents immediately start to crank up their noise machine to distort and &quot;jam&quot; our message. 

NOM and the rest have tried to claim victimhood and bigotry, religious persecution, and a whole host of things they were the first to inflict on us. The hint we should take from this is that our reasoning and messages have them worried that we will prevail. We need to stay on and expand these messages to our advantage.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>I’ve noticed that more and more right-wing fundamentalists are comparing their efforts to civil rights struggles. Is this a shallow attempt to appeal to African Americans, or to liberals of various races?<i><b>—Ahab</b></i></p></blockquote>
<p>This is a political tactic—attempt to co opt the terminology and tactics of your opponent. By confusing the meaning of the words and concepts they are intended to convey, our opponents seek to blunt the clearly obvious and logical case we are making for LGBT civil rights. </p>
<p>Such techniques have a tendency to work in our modern times even more than they have in the past because of the rapid spread of information provided by 24-hour cable &#8220;news&#8221; and the large echo chamber provided by new media such as the Internet. It&#8217;s an old technique though.</p>
<p>It also provides us with a hint. The instant we gain traction with a particular idea, such as in this case drawing parallels between the black civil rights movement and our own struggle, our opponents immediately start to crank up their noise machine to distort and &#8220;jam&#8221; our message. </p>
<p>NOM and the rest have tried to claim victimhood and bigotry, religious persecution, and a whole host of things they were the first to inflict on us. The hint we should take from this is that our reasoning and messages have them worried that we will prevail. We need to stay on and expand these messages to our advantage.</p>
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		<title>By: TampaZeke</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/08/15/25445/comment-page-1#comment-75902</link>
		<dc:creator>TampaZeke</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Aug 2010 02:31:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=25445#comment-75902</guid>
		<description>The sad irony of seeing an African-American woman proudly holding a sign stating, &quot;Let the people vote&quot;, referring to the civil rights of an oppressed minority.

This just a very few miles away from the state line of Virginia, the capital of the Confederate South and the home of Mildred and Richard Loving.

&quot;Let the people vote&quot; indeed!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The sad irony of seeing an African-American woman proudly holding a sign stating, &#8220;Let the people vote&#8221;, referring to the civil rights of an oppressed minority.</p>
<p>This just a very few miles away from the state line of Virginia, the capital of the Confederate South and the home of Mildred and Richard Loving.</p>
<p>&#8220;Let the people vote&#8221; indeed!</p>
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		<title>By: Candace</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/08/15/25445/comment-page-1#comment-75901</link>
		<dc:creator>Candace</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Aug 2010 02:27:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=25445#comment-75901</guid>
		<description>You mean, &quot;Adam and Eve and Cain and his mom/sister or probably both?&quot;

As for this:

&quot;Isn’t this the kind of fanaticism you would expect from the 9/11 suicide bombers?&quot;

Nah, just the usual Afrofundie ranting style.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You mean, &#8220;Adam and Eve and Cain and his mom/sister or probably both?&#8221;</p>
<p>As for this:</p>
<p>&#8220;Isn’t this the kind of fanaticism you would expect from the 9/11 suicide bombers?&#8221;</p>
<p>Nah, just the usual Afrofundie ranting style.</p>
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