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	<title>Comments on: &#8220;86 Percent&#8221; of Tony Perkins&#8217;s Statistics Are Rubbish</title>
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	<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/11/29/28112</link>
	<description>News, analysis and fact-checking of anti-gay rhetoric</description>
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		<title>By: Marlene</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/11/29/28112/comment-page-1#comment-84423</link>
		<dc:creator>Marlene</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Dec 2010 19:36:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=28112#comment-84423</guid>
		<description>Here&#039;s what I&#039;m going to send to those who think it&#039;s being &quot;balanced&quot; by having bigots like Perkins and their ilk on their show when talking about LGBT issues:

&quot;I&#039;d like to know if you&#039;re going to have a leader of Hamas or a similar group on for &quot;balance&quot;, next time you talk about Israel.

I&#039;d also like to know when you&#039;ll have a member of the Klan or a neo-Nazi group as &quot;balance&quot; the next time your show talks about race relations in the US.

Why do I ask you that? Because you recently had a member of a known hate group on your show, supposedly as &quot;balance&quot; when the show discussed something having to do with a LGBT issue.

Please go look up the Southern Poverty Law Center&#039;s newest additions to their list of hate groups, and realize the fact there&#039;s no difference between Hamas, the Klan, and a group like the Family Research Council in the view of the SPLC.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here&#8217;s what I&#8217;m going to send to those who think it&#8217;s being &#8220;balanced&#8221; by having bigots like Perkins and their ilk on their show when talking about LGBT issues:</p>
<p>&#8220;I&#8217;d like to know if you&#8217;re going to have a leader of Hamas or a similar group on for &#8220;balance&#8221;, next time you talk about Israel.</p>
<p>I&#8217;d also like to know when you&#8217;ll have a member of the Klan or a neo-Nazi group as &#8220;balance&#8221; the next time your show talks about race relations in the US.</p>
<p>Why do I ask you that? Because you recently had a member of a known hate group on your show, supposedly as &#8220;balance&#8221; when the show discussed something having to do with a LGBT issue.</p>
<p>Please go look up the Southern Poverty Law Center&#8217;s newest additions to their list of hate groups, and realize the fact there&#8217;s no difference between Hamas, the Klan, and a group like the Family Research Council in the view of the SPLC.</p>
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		<title>By: David C.</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/11/29/28112/comment-page-1#comment-84289</link>
		<dc:creator>David C.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Dec 2010 05:02:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=28112#comment-84289</guid>
		<description>Note that Chris Matthews has now &lt;a href=&quot;http://joemygod.blogspot.com/2010/12/chris-matthews-busts-tony-perkins-lies.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;set at least part of the record straight&lt;/a&gt;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Note that Chris Matthews has now <a href="http://joemygod.blogspot.com/2010/12/chris-matthews-busts-tony-perkins-lies.html" rel="nofollow">set at least part of the record straight</a>.</p>
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		<title>By: Priya Lynn</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/11/29/28112/comment-page-1#comment-84208</link>
		<dc:creator>Priya Lynn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Dec 2010 15:38:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=28112#comment-84208</guid>
		<description>No problem, Jim.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>No problem, Jim.</p>
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		<title>By: JJMoody</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/11/29/28112/comment-page-1#comment-84194</link>
		<dc:creator>JJMoody</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Dec 2010 06:18:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=28112#comment-84194</guid>
		<description>A poster above made the comment that free speech isn&#039;t free and not all speech is protected by the Constitution, both are true statements. Unfortunately though, Perkins&#039; speech is protected by the Constitution. Even hate speech is considered protected speech under the protections of the First Amendment. SCOTUS has upheld the free speech rights of the KKK and similar groups several times. 

The reason people have such a problem refuting all of Perkins crap is that he throws out so much complete and total BS at one time that it is next to impossible to address all his lies and misleading and false information without a much longer time than is usually provided in a format like this one. Perkins knows that and he takes full advantage of that fact. 

The fact that he and his buddies hide behind organizations that have a veil of respectability by using names that are very similar to actual recognized groups doesn&#039;t help. Most of the public doesn&#039;t know the difference, and honestly they don&#039;t have a reason to know the difference. Another thing Perkins and his type count on. 

These people are hard to deal with and they know it, they love that they are hard to deal with. 

They will eventually hang themselves with all the rope they have tossed out, but until then we have to continue to do what we can to refute their speech with truth and reason. 

Their desperation is already showing in so many ways and they know.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A poster above made the comment that free speech isn&#8217;t free and not all speech is protected by the Constitution, both are true statements. Unfortunately though, Perkins&#8217; speech is protected by the Constitution. Even hate speech is considered protected speech under the protections of the First Amendment. SCOTUS has upheld the free speech rights of the KKK and similar groups several times. </p>
<p>The reason people have such a problem refuting all of Perkins crap is that he throws out so much complete and total BS at one time that it is next to impossible to address all his lies and misleading and false information without a much longer time than is usually provided in a format like this one. Perkins knows that and he takes full advantage of that fact. </p>
<p>The fact that he and his buddies hide behind organizations that have a veil of respectability by using names that are very similar to actual recognized groups doesn&#8217;t help. Most of the public doesn&#8217;t know the difference, and honestly they don&#8217;t have a reason to know the difference. Another thing Perkins and his type count on. </p>
<p>These people are hard to deal with and they know it, they love that they are hard to deal with. </p>
<p>They will eventually hang themselves with all the rope they have tossed out, but until then we have to continue to do what we can to refute their speech with truth and reason. </p>
<p>Their desperation is already showing in so many ways and they know.</p>
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		<title>By: Jim Burroway</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/11/29/28112/comment-page-1#comment-84178</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim Burroway</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Dec 2010 02:12:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=28112#comment-84178</guid>
		<description>Priya Lynn,

True, but I missed it because you went about it differently. Instead of pointing our attention to the quoted sentence directly as a misquote, you went with the math instead. And as everyone knows, math is hard. ;-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Priya Lynn,</p>
<p>True, but I missed it because you went about it differently. Instead of pointing our attention to the quoted sentence directly as a misquote, you went with the math instead. And as everyone knows, math is hard. ;-)</p>
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		<title>By: Priya Lynn</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/11/29/28112/comment-page-1#comment-84174</link>
		<dc:creator>Priya Lynn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Dec 2010 01:32:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=28112#comment-84174</guid>
		<description>Jim, thanks for giving someone else the credit for what I pointed out first. *sniff*</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jim, thanks for giving someone else the credit for what I pointed out first. *sniff*</p>
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		<title>By: cls</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/11/29/28112/comment-page-1#comment-84173</link>
		<dc:creator>cls</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Dec 2010 01:29:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=28112#comment-84173</guid>
		<description>Yep, that was the old bait and switch. Start out talking about men who molest children, then take a quote only about men who molest boys and then try to apply that to the total universe. 

Another important factor to consider is that the laws are out of sync with clinical terms. A child molester is defined legally. If the law defined child as anyone under the age of 30 then almost ever adult would be a child molester at one time or another. 

Pedophiles are usually attracted to children per se, not to one gender or another. And it is true most of them do not identify as gay. True pedophiles often engage with children of both genders. 

But the law includes adolescents in the category of child. Individuals who are sexually interested in teens, ephebophilia, do tend to differentiate. 

So when they research men who &quot;molest children&quot; knowing whether we are talking about true children (prepubescent) or merely those legally defined as children, but who are pubescent) can change things rather dramatically. 

if the former is used for the study then few gay men would show up. Most those individuals would not be interested in adults and those who are would tend to identify as straight. 

Adding pubescent teens (often very willing teens) changes the mix. Now you would get people who identify as gay and straight both. But since the law tends to crack down on same-sex relationships more than opposite sex ones, gay men would be over-represented in this mix, not because they are more likely to have sex with teens, but because they are more likely to be prosecuted for it.

For instance some states still criminalize same-sex relationships if one partner is under 18 but the same age dichotomy would be legal if they were an opposite sex couple.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yep, that was the old bait and switch. Start out talking about men who molest children, then take a quote only about men who molest boys and then try to apply that to the total universe. </p>
<p>Another important factor to consider is that the laws are out of sync with clinical terms. A child molester is defined legally. If the law defined child as anyone under the age of 30 then almost ever adult would be a child molester at one time or another. </p>
<p>Pedophiles are usually attracted to children per se, not to one gender or another. And it is true most of them do not identify as gay. True pedophiles often engage with children of both genders. </p>
<p>But the law includes adolescents in the category of child. Individuals who are sexually interested in teens, ephebophilia, do tend to differentiate. </p>
<p>So when they research men who &#8220;molest children&#8221; knowing whether we are talking about true children (prepubescent) or merely those legally defined as children, but who are pubescent) can change things rather dramatically. </p>
<p>if the former is used for the study then few gay men would show up. Most those individuals would not be interested in adults and those who are would tend to identify as straight. </p>
<p>Adding pubescent teens (often very willing teens) changes the mix. Now you would get people who identify as gay and straight both. But since the law tends to crack down on same-sex relationships more than opposite sex ones, gay men would be over-represented in this mix, not because they are more likely to have sex with teens, but because they are more likely to be prosecuted for it.</p>
<p>For instance some states still criminalize same-sex relationships if one partner is under 18 but the same age dichotomy would be legal if they were an opposite sex couple.</p>
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		<title>By: Priya Lynn</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/11/29/28112/comment-page-1#comment-84171</link>
		<dc:creator>Priya Lynn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Dec 2010 01:04:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=28112#comment-84171</guid>
		<description>Bad Wolf said &quot;Did anybody notice the change in the quote?&quot;.

Yes, I pointed it out in my comment immediately prior to your comment.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bad Wolf said &#8220;Did anybody notice the change in the quote?&#8221;.</p>
<p>Yes, I pointed it out in my comment immediately prior to your comment.</p>
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		<title>By: Jim Burroway</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/11/29/28112/comment-page-1#comment-84169</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim Burroway</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Dec 2010 00:53:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=28112#comment-84169</guid>
		<description>Bad Wolf,

Good lord. How could we all have missed that?   I&#039;ve updated the post accordingly. To Timothy&#039;s point, a male predator who preys on male children isn&#039;t necessarily gay or bisexual. But still, a major misquoting like that is important. Great catch. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bad Wolf,</p>
<p>Good lord. How could we all have missed that?   I&#8217;ve updated the post accordingly. To Timothy&#8217;s point, a male predator who preys on male children isn&#8217;t necessarily gay or bisexual. But still, a major misquoting like that is important. Great catch. </p>
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		<title>By: Timothy Kincaid</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2010/11/29/28112/comment-page-1#comment-84168</link>
		<dc:creator>Timothy Kincaid</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Dec 2010 00:53:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=28112#comment-84168</guid>
		<description>Bad Wolf,

&lt;blockquote&gt;One might expect that a (male)pedophile who preys on (male) victims might be homosexual…&lt;/blockquote&gt;

One might expect such a thing, but one would be wrong.  Actually very few pedophiles who prey on male victims have adult homosexual attractions.  Most are avowed heterosexuals - if they have any adult attractions at all.

See our analysis &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/Articles/000,002.htm&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;here.&lt;/a&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bad Wolf,</p>
<blockquote><p>One might expect that a (male)pedophile who preys on (male) victims might be homosexual…</p></blockquote>
<p>One might expect such a thing, but one would be wrong.  Actually very few pedophiles who prey on male victims have adult homosexual attractions.  Most are avowed heterosexuals &#8211; if they have any adult attractions at all.</p>
<p>See our analysis <a href="http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/Articles/000,002.htm" rel="nofollow" class="articleLink">here.</a></p>
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