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	<title>Comments on: Manager At Scott Lively&#8217;s Coffee Shop A Convicted Child Molester</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2011/01/13/29486/feed" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2011/01/13/29486</link>
	<description>News, analysis and fact-checking of anti-gay rhetoric</description>
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		<title>By: L. Junius Brutus</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2011/01/13/29486/comment-page-1#comment-87146</link>
		<dc:creator>L. Junius Brutus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 15 Jan 2011 22:00:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=29486#comment-87146</guid>
		<description>Priya: &quot;There’s your wonderful justice system Junius – keep it.&quot;

A shame that you need to stoop to misrepresentation - a sign that even you know that just about everything you write is nonsense. Of course, I was only talking about the death penalty - and the death penalty system works when it&#039;s found that the accused person is innocent before he is executed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Priya: &#8220;There’s your wonderful justice system Junius – keep it.&#8221;</p>
<p>A shame that you need to stoop to misrepresentation &#8211; a sign that even you know that just about everything you write is nonsense. Of course, I was only talking about the death penalty &#8211; and the death penalty system works when it&#8217;s found that the accused person is innocent before he is executed.</p>
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		<title>By: Priya Lynn</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2011/01/13/29486/comment-page-1#comment-87130</link>
		<dc:creator>Priya Lynn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 15 Jan 2011 19:24:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=29486#comment-87130</guid>
		<description>Blake said &quot;for example a 17 year old in GA was sentenced to 10 years and forever has to register as a sex offender because he received a BJ from a 15 year old girl&quot;.

There&#039;s your wonderful justice system Junius - keep it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Blake said &#8220;for example a 17 year old in GA was sentenced to 10 years and forever has to register as a sex offender because he received a BJ from a 15 year old girl&#8221;.</p>
<p>There&#8217;s your wonderful justice system Junius &#8211; keep it.</p>
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		<title>By: Regan DuCasse</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2011/01/13/29486/comment-page-1#comment-87127</link>
		<dc:creator>Regan DuCasse</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 15 Jan 2011 19:08:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=29486#comment-87127</guid>
		<description>And JB I agree with you. Consent based, although statutory rape between those who are close in age, do NOT compare to someone violently attacking a child.

    No one like that should EVER be released. Then issues like this would never happen. As we speak there are child rapists who were recently released here in CA because of budget cuts, who aren&#039;t not subject to probation.
 Mostly they go and live with their parents, or girlfriend. And are under no particular scrutiny from the law.

   Sometimes they live near where children are present. Or living in the home with them.
Reoffending is a guarantee. And the people they live with are useless when it comes to monitoring.

 Indeed, the murder of Chelsea King in SD occurred because a paroled rapist lived with his parents, near this teenager and where she regularly jogged.
As part of a plea deal, he told authorities where he&#039;d buried another younger girl a year before who&#039;d gone missing.

    His first offense was exceptionally violent on a 14 year old. Why he was released after serving only seven years after that, to kill the subsequent two, and why his parents didn&#039;t police him isn&#039;t a mystery.

  Cowards and weak lawmakers are running things.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And JB I agree with you. Consent based, although statutory rape between those who are close in age, do NOT compare to someone violently attacking a child.</p>
<p>    No one like that should EVER be released. Then issues like this would never happen. As we speak there are child rapists who were recently released here in CA because of budget cuts, who aren&#8217;t not subject to probation.<br />
 Mostly they go and live with their parents, or girlfriend. And are under no particular scrutiny from the law.</p>
<p>   Sometimes they live near where children are present. Or living in the home with them.<br />
Reoffending is a guarantee. And the people they live with are useless when it comes to monitoring.</p>
<p> Indeed, the murder of Chelsea King in SD occurred because a paroled rapist lived with his parents, near this teenager and where she regularly jogged.<br />
As part of a plea deal, he told authorities where he&#8217;d buried another younger girl a year before who&#8217;d gone missing.</p>
<p>    His first offense was exceptionally violent on a 14 year old. Why he was released after serving only seven years after that, to kill the subsequent two, and why his parents didn&#8217;t police him isn&#8217;t a mystery.</p>
<p>  Cowards and weak lawmakers are running things.</p>
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		<title>By: Regan DuCasse</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2011/01/13/29486/comment-page-1#comment-87126</link>
		<dc:creator>Regan DuCasse</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 15 Jan 2011 19:01:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=29486#comment-87126</guid>
		<description>Hi Blake, to your point regarding that their faith is about not undermining their
religious belief and how they understand it and express it to others.

   Nothing can undermine faith and TRUST quicker than being so arrogant in that belief that a record of criminal abuse of another human being, trumps common sense protections for others.
 And there is so little CONSISTENCY.

  There are whole political campaigns around how gay people threaten everything dear to compassionate people, while at the same time, making no distinctions between gay people and those who actually DO and HAVE harmed someone outright.

  There are no whole political campaigns for any other categories. Not even criminal categories to keep offenders from having full rights and freedoms over someone who is gay.
  There is a pay it forward manipulation going on and it&#039;s not only appalling, but serves criminals more than it does the public good.
I don&#039;t care what religion a person is.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Blake, to your point regarding that their faith is about not undermining their<br />
religious belief and how they understand it and express it to others.</p>
<p>   Nothing can undermine faith and TRUST quicker than being so arrogant in that belief that a record of criminal abuse of another human being, trumps common sense protections for others.<br />
 And there is so little CONSISTENCY.</p>
<p>  There are whole political campaigns around how gay people threaten everything dear to compassionate people, while at the same time, making no distinctions between gay people and those who actually DO and HAVE harmed someone outright.</p>
<p>  There are no whole political campaigns for any other categories. Not even criminal categories to keep offenders from having full rights and freedoms over someone who is gay.<br />
  There is a pay it forward manipulation going on and it&#8217;s not only appalling, but serves criminals more than it does the public good.<br />
I don&#8217;t care what religion a person is.</p>
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		<title>By: L. Junius Brutus</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2011/01/13/29486/comment-page-1#comment-87061</link>
		<dc:creator>L. Junius Brutus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 15 Jan 2011 00:25:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=29486#comment-87061</guid>
		<description>A 17-year old boy sleeping with his 15-year old girlfriend is not child molestation. Any punishment for such a person is wrong, not just 10 years. The people who are actually child molesters, like this rapist of a 11-year old girl, should be stigmatized forever, in fact, they should never be released.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A 17-year old boy sleeping with his 15-year old girlfriend is not child molestation. Any punishment for such a person is wrong, not just 10 years. The people who are actually child molesters, like this rapist of a 11-year old girl, should be stigmatized forever, in fact, they should never be released.</p>
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		<title>By: Blake Alverson</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2011/01/13/29486/comment-page-1#comment-87054</link>
		<dc:creator>Blake Alverson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 14 Jan 2011 22:16:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=29486#comment-87054</guid>
		<description>I think both Lively and Cardinal Mahoney just both sincerely believe that because someone says Christ is now the center in their life that they won&#039;t commit the horrible sins they committed in the past. It’s not so much they&#039;re trying to cover their asses, it’s that they truly believe the people to be reformed because to believe otherwise would undermine their faith. I think naiveté and a desire to protect the faith/institution from bad press is more driving than any desire to protect money/assets. A typical justification probably sounds like: “If Priest John Doe or Christian Coffee Shop Manager James Doe is really abusing children then we need to not accuse him of it publicly because to do so would undermine the faith of the hundreds of others he brought into Christ’s arms.” Not to mention the lack of redemption after converting their life to Christ. 
Such cover-ups only inevitably lead to more horrible abuses by trusted people and then more hiding because the person committing the abuses is held up as an example of faith to others.  
While I am uncomfortable with &quot;guilty then, guilty forever&quot; convections that many child molesters receive (for example a 17 year old in GA was sentenced to 10 years and forever has to register as a sex offender because he received a BJ from a 15 year old girl) I am very suspect of this individual, if he really wanted to join a Christian Ministry, considering his struggles in the past, wouldn’t he want to join one where there weren’t underage kids running around all the time.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think both Lively and Cardinal Mahoney just both sincerely believe that because someone says Christ is now the center in their life that they won&#8217;t commit the horrible sins they committed in the past. It’s not so much they&#8217;re trying to cover their asses, it’s that they truly believe the people to be reformed because to believe otherwise would undermine their faith. I think naiveté and a desire to protect the faith/institution from bad press is more driving than any desire to protect money/assets. A typical justification probably sounds like: “If Priest John Doe or Christian Coffee Shop Manager James Doe is really abusing children then we need to not accuse him of it publicly because to do so would undermine the faith of the hundreds of others he brought into Christ’s arms.” Not to mention the lack of redemption after converting their life to Christ.<br />
Such cover-ups only inevitably lead to more horrible abuses by trusted people and then more hiding because the person committing the abuses is held up as an example of faith to others.<br />
While I am uncomfortable with &#8220;guilty then, guilty forever&#8221; convections that many child molesters receive (for example a 17 year old in GA was sentenced to 10 years and forever has to register as a sex offender because he received a BJ from a 15 year old girl) I am very suspect of this individual, if he really wanted to join a Christian Ministry, considering his struggles in the past, wouldn’t he want to join one where there weren’t underage kids running around all the time.</p>
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		<title>By: Regan DuCasse</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2011/01/13/29486/comment-page-1#comment-87050</link>
		<dc:creator>Regan DuCasse</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 14 Jan 2011 21:38:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=29486#comment-87050</guid>
		<description>Several good and accurate points here. Mainly that ministers, or people who like to think that claiming to be redeemed or taking on Christian or whatever faith, automatically makes a person trustworthy and worthy of forgetting their past transgressions and crimes.

   I find that the general public is extremely ignorant (and sometimes willfully so) about sex criminals. About the incarcerated and about who gets clipped for what the public considers minor charges (mainly that have to do with drug use.)
    Now when it comes to ministries and Christian outreach. They can be exceptionally naive as much as arrogant to think that a SOCIOPATH isn&#039;t manipulating them to get what the sociopath wants, not what the minister and their adherents expect.

   I can tell you that law enforcers, probation officers and sex crime specialists get VERY frustrated and stonewalled by people like Lively.
Cardinal Mahoney was actively obfuscating our detectives here when it comes to finding sex offenders among priests. He&#039;s but one of many people who represent churches more interested in covering their asses and their financial assets, than protecting anyone else.

      And just as I witness anti gay straight people, or just ignorant people continually argue that gay people choose to be gay, I can&#039;t believe I have civilians arguing with me about criminals after I give them MY credentials.
     
  But religious do gooders do more harm this way. And criminals know what buttons to push to get access or to hide.
 When, when, WHEN are people with a public forum gonna wise UP?

      Homophobia gives a lot of people shelter from their offenses by keeping the public ignorant and focused from the REAL sex offenders.
And there are some ministers who really shouldn&#039;t get so full of themselves they lose sight of the bigger picture.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Several good and accurate points here. Mainly that ministers, or people who like to think that claiming to be redeemed or taking on Christian or whatever faith, automatically makes a person trustworthy and worthy of forgetting their past transgressions and crimes.</p>
<p>   I find that the general public is extremely ignorant (and sometimes willfully so) about sex criminals. About the incarcerated and about who gets clipped for what the public considers minor charges (mainly that have to do with drug use.)<br />
    Now when it comes to ministries and Christian outreach. They can be exceptionally naive as much as arrogant to think that a SOCIOPATH isn&#8217;t manipulating them to get what the sociopath wants, not what the minister and their adherents expect.</p>
<p>   I can tell you that law enforcers, probation officers and sex crime specialists get VERY frustrated and stonewalled by people like Lively.<br />
Cardinal Mahoney was actively obfuscating our detectives here when it comes to finding sex offenders among priests. He&#8217;s but one of many people who represent churches more interested in covering their asses and their financial assets, than protecting anyone else.</p>
<p>      And just as I witness anti gay straight people, or just ignorant people continually argue that gay people choose to be gay, I can&#8217;t believe I have civilians arguing with me about criminals after I give them MY credentials.</p>
<p>  But religious do gooders do more harm this way. And criminals know what buttons to push to get access or to hide.<br />
 When, when, WHEN are people with a public forum gonna wise UP?</p>
<p>      Homophobia gives a lot of people shelter from their offenses by keeping the public ignorant and focused from the REAL sex offenders.<br />
And there are some ministers who really shouldn&#8217;t get so full of themselves they lose sight of the bigger picture.</p>
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		<title>By: justsearching</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2011/01/13/29486/comment-page-1#comment-87030</link>
		<dc:creator>justsearching</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 14 Jan 2011 16:39:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=29486#comment-87030</guid>
		<description>I find the most remarkable part of the story to be this sentence: &quot;Lively said he will consult with his ministry board regarding any change in use of Frediani as the coffee house manager.&quot; In other words, there needs to be deliberation about whether or not this Level 3 sex offender should continue to work at this hang out place for kids.

The correct answer is: &quot;I didn&#039;t know about his past, and now I will be looking for a new manager for this establishment.&quot; Lively creeps me out.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I find the most remarkable part of the story to be this sentence: &#8220;Lively said he will consult with his ministry board regarding any change in use of Frediani as the coffee house manager.&#8221; In other words, there needs to be deliberation about whether or not this Level 3 sex offender should continue to work at this hang out place for kids.</p>
<p>The correct answer is: &#8220;I didn&#8217;t know about his past, and now I will be looking for a new manager for this establishment.&#8221; Lively creeps me out.</p>
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		<title>By: Paul in Canada</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2011/01/13/29486/comment-page-1#comment-87021</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul in Canada</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 14 Jan 2011 14:35:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=29486#comment-87021</guid>
		<description>I keep reading and re-reading this story.  Never in my wildest imaginings did I expect this outcome from such a slimey character like Herr Lively. I hope the blogs will continue to follow this story because it truely is about what is done next that will be most telling (Lively and the police).

Good, great, gawd!

If ever these was something to rally around and demand this &#039;establishment&#039; is closed down, it&#039;s this damn &#039;coffee house&#039;.

p.s. - coffee houses were popular amongst the christianists in the 60&#039;s and 70&#039;s - what decade does this wingnut live in?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I keep reading and re-reading this story.  Never in my wildest imaginings did I expect this outcome from such a slimey character like Herr Lively. I hope the blogs will continue to follow this story because it truely is about what is done next that will be most telling (Lively and the police).</p>
<p>Good, great, gawd!</p>
<p>If ever these was something to rally around and demand this &#8216;establishment&#8217; is closed down, it&#8217;s this damn &#8216;coffee house&#8217;.</p>
<p>p.s. &#8211; coffee houses were popular amongst the christianists in the 60&#8242;s and 70&#8242;s &#8211; what decade does this wingnut live in?</p>
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		<title>By: BlackDog</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2011/01/13/29486/comment-page-1#comment-87019</link>
		<dc:creator>BlackDog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 14 Jan 2011 14:10:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=29486#comment-87019</guid>
		<description>There really aren&#039;t any words to describe just how disgusted I am by this.

You have to pass a background check to cook, do dishes and mop floors where I work, there are much more extensive checks for table games dealers, management, security, etc. Sweet Jesus, those &quot;Christians&quot; will hire people who&#039;d never be allowed to work at the casino where I work. Hell, if I had a business (and I have had one before) let alone a ministry of some sort I would never hire a convicted child molester, period. Not just for the potential bad press or inability to look at myself in the mirror but because that&#039;s a risk to KIDS for God&#039;s sake!

It never ceases to amaze me how little consideration supposedly &quot;family friendly&quot; Authoritarian/Fundamentalist Christianity shows for actual children or women.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There really aren&#8217;t any words to describe just how disgusted I am by this.</p>
<p>You have to pass a background check to cook, do dishes and mop floors where I work, there are much more extensive checks for table games dealers, management, security, etc. Sweet Jesus, those &#8220;Christians&#8221; will hire people who&#8217;d never be allowed to work at the casino where I work. Hell, if I had a business (and I have had one before) let alone a ministry of some sort I would never hire a convicted child molester, period. Not just for the potential bad press or inability to look at myself in the mirror but because that&#8217;s a risk to KIDS for God&#8217;s sake!</p>
<p>It never ceases to amaze me how little consideration supposedly &#8220;family friendly&#8221; Authoritarian/Fundamentalist Christianity shows for actual children or women.</p>
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