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	<title>Comments on: &#8220;Traditional Marriage&#8221; Arguments and Polygamy (or: The slippery slope is on their side of the hill)</title>
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	<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2013/02/01/53423</link>
	<description>News, analysis and fact-checking of anti-gay rhetoric</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Tue, 21 May 2013 15:31:19 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Marcus</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2013/02/01/53423/comment-page-1#comment-245458</link>
		<dc:creator>Marcus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Feb 2013 20:46:32 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>IMHO, a lot of you are overthinking the accidental pregnancy argument. It&#039;s simply &quot;But they don&#039;t &lt;i&gt;need&lt;/i&gt; marriage because they can&#039;t accidentally get knocked up!&quot; 

Of course, nobody&#039;s denying postmenopausal women the right to marry, so it&#039;s not a sincere argument, but that&#039;s the argument.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>IMHO, a lot of you are overthinking the accidental pregnancy argument. It&#8217;s simply &#8220;But they don&#8217;t <i>need</i> marriage because they can&#8217;t accidentally get knocked up!&#8221; </p>
<p>Of course, nobody&#8217;s denying postmenopausal women the right to marry, so it&#8217;s not a sincere argument, but that&#8217;s the argument.</p>
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		<title>By: Ben in Oakland</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2013/02/01/53423/comment-page-1#comment-245415</link>
		<dc:creator>Ben in Oakland</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Feb 2013 19:39:18 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Ian, it&#039;s a recognized porn subgenre. Two chest, and so forth. But none of this is advanced for incestuous marriage.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ian, it&#8217;s a recognized porn subgenre. Two chest, and so forth. But none of this is advanced for incestuous marriage.</p>
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		<title>By: Gene in L.A.</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2013/02/01/53423/comment-page-1#comment-245376</link>
		<dc:creator>Gene in L.A.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Feb 2013 18:23:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=53423#comment-245376</guid>
		<description>Is the idea that marriage was developed as a legal means of property control rather than of holding parents responsible its own number on this list of ten? If not, why not mention it here?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Is the idea that marriage was developed as a legal means of property control rather than of holding parents responsible its own number on this list of ten? If not, why not mention it here?</p>
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		<title>By: Ian</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2013/02/01/53423/comment-page-1#comment-245316</link>
		<dc:creator>Ian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Feb 2013 16:23:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=53423#comment-245316</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t have a problem with dealing with polygamy slopes, but incestuous ones... like gay brothers, that one just twists my mind.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t have a problem with dealing with polygamy slopes, but incestuous ones&#8230; like gay brothers, that one just twists my mind.</p>
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		<title>By: Ben in Oakland</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2013/02/01/53423/comment-page-1#comment-245311</link>
		<dc:creator>Ben in Oakland</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Feb 2013 16:15:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=53423#comment-245311</guid>
		<description>Polygamy is, everywhere in the world where it is practiced, strictly a heterosexual institution. In fact, in Africa, polygamy is a heterosexual CHRISTIAN institution. The president of South Africa, quite a Christian, has, I believe, FOUR wives.

For this reason, their freedom of religion argument undermines their polygamy argument. If a man can marry a woman, and his religion either permits or demands that he marries four women, then why can&#039;t he?

&quot;But if we redefine marriage as simply a loving, romantic union between committed adults, what principled reason would we have for rejecting polygamist or polyamorous — that is, multiple-person — relationships as marriages?&quot; Same question. If a man can marry a woman, why can&#039;t he marry four? And what does the answer to that question have to do with gay people marrying? 

there are a lot of reasons why-- the need for a wholesale rewrite of all child, family, labor, welfare, and contract laws, just for starters. for gay people, all that is required is to change &quot;man and a woman&quot; to &quot;two unrelated competent adults.&quot; ery thing remains the same.

As for marriage being for irresponsible straight people, that was the same argument that the Supreme Court (or whatever it is) in New York advanced for not allowing gay marriage. I always have to ask: &quot;Who is it again that&#039;s trying to redefine marriage?&quot; Because THAT idea certainly is a redefinition of marriage, a slap in the face to every actually married couple, and in complete opposition to the idea that straight people aren&#039;t supposed to have sex until they are married.

Having attended over 1000 weddings, i have never heard that reason discussed, even if it were true.If I were still photographing weddings, I could hardly wait to hear Msgr. Ratzi announce, &quot;we are gathered here together becuase John accidentally knocked up Mitzi&quot;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Polygamy is, everywhere in the world where it is practiced, strictly a heterosexual institution. In fact, in Africa, polygamy is a heterosexual CHRISTIAN institution. The president of South Africa, quite a Christian, has, I believe, FOUR wives.</p>
<p>For this reason, their freedom of religion argument undermines their polygamy argument. If a man can marry a woman, and his religion either permits or demands that he marries four women, then why can&#8217;t he?</p>
<p>&#8220;But if we redefine marriage as simply a loving, romantic union between committed adults, what principled reason would we have for rejecting polygamist or polyamorous — that is, multiple-person — relationships as marriages?&#8221; Same question. If a man can marry a woman, why can&#8217;t he marry four? And what does the answer to that question have to do with gay people marrying? </p>
<p>there are a lot of reasons why&#8211; the need for a wholesale rewrite of all child, family, labor, welfare, and contract laws, just for starters. for gay people, all that is required is to change &#8220;man and a woman&#8221; to &#8220;two unrelated competent adults.&#8221; ery thing remains the same.</p>
<p>As for marriage being for irresponsible straight people, that was the same argument that the Supreme Court (or whatever it is) in New York advanced for not allowing gay marriage. I always have to ask: &#8220;Who is it again that&#8217;s trying to redefine marriage?&#8221; Because THAT idea certainly is a redefinition of marriage, a slap in the face to every actually married couple, and in complete opposition to the idea that straight people aren&#8217;t supposed to have sex until they are married.</p>
<p>Having attended over 1000 weddings, i have never heard that reason discussed, even if it were true.If I were still photographing weddings, I could hardly wait to hear Msgr. Ratzi announce, &#8220;we are gathered here together becuase John accidentally knocked up Mitzi&#8221;.</p>
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		<title>By: jpeckjr</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2013/02/01/53423/comment-page-1#comment-245273</link>
		<dc:creator>jpeckjr</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Feb 2013 15:42:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=53423#comment-245273</guid>
		<description>I have been trying for 30 minutes to write a response to the &quot;accidental pregnancy&quot; argument.  But I am not stupid enough to come up with one.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have been trying for 30 minutes to write a response to the &#8220;accidental pregnancy&#8221; argument.  But I am not stupid enough to come up with one.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2013/02/01/53423/comment-page-1#comment-245243</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Feb 2013 14:53:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=53423#comment-245243</guid>
		<description>Marriage isn&#039;t about biological parents at all. As far as it is about children and parenting (which isn&#039;t the exclusive reason for it), it&#039;s about tying de-facto parents to their children. 

For example step children are automatically one&#039;s children when marrying. No adoption needed. When doing artificial insemination, the husband of the woman is usually automatically the father. Although he isn&#039;t the biological father. In Iowa a court ruled decades ago that a soldier returning from WWII was the legal parent to his wife&#039;s child although there was no chance that he conceived it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Marriage isn&#8217;t about biological parents at all. As far as it is about children and parenting (which isn&#8217;t the exclusive reason for it), it&#8217;s about tying de-facto parents to their children. </p>
<p>For example step children are automatically one&#8217;s children when marrying. No adoption needed. When doing artificial insemination, the husband of the woman is usually automatically the father. Although he isn&#8217;t the biological father. In Iowa a court ruled decades ago that a soldier returning from WWII was the legal parent to his wife&#8217;s child although there was no chance that he conceived it.</p>
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		<title>By: David in Houston</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2013/02/01/53423/comment-page-1#comment-245159</link>
		<dc:creator>David in Houston</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Feb 2013 12:10:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=53423#comment-245159</guid>
		<description>The argument about accidental procreation is probably their most idiotic so far. They&#039;re basically saying that because straight couples are SO unbelievably irresponsible they deserve special treatment under the law; and that gay couples should be excluded because they AREN&#039;T irresponsible at all. I&#039;m surprised they weren&#039;t laughed out of court.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The argument about accidental procreation is probably their most idiotic so far. They&#8217;re basically saying that because straight couples are SO unbelievably irresponsible they deserve special treatment under the law; and that gay couples should be excluded because they AREN&#8217;T irresponsible at all. I&#8217;m surprised they weren&#8217;t laughed out of court.</p>
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		<title>By: Hunter</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2013/02/01/53423/comment-page-1#comment-245074</link>
		<dc:creator>Hunter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Feb 2013 09:57:10 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>The accidental pregnancy argument has absolutely nothing to do with denying same-sex couples the right to marry.  The whole argument has no bearing on the question whatsoever.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The accidental pregnancy argument has absolutely nothing to do with denying same-sex couples the right to marry.  The whole argument has no bearing on the question whatsoever.</p>
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		<title>By: F Young</title>
		<link>http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2013/02/01/53423/comment-page-1#comment-244989</link>
		<dc:creator>F Young</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Feb 2013 07:28:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/?p=53423#comment-244989</guid>
		<description>As an aside, if polygamous marriage ever gets legally recognized, it will be precisely because religious groups demand it. Historically, polygamous marriage has always been founded on religion; the Koran, the Bible and the Book of Mormon all sanction polygamy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As an aside, if polygamous marriage ever gets legally recognized, it will be precisely because religious groups demand it. Historically, polygamous marriage has always been founded on religion; the Koran, the Bible and the Book of Mormon all sanction polygamy.</p>
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