Box Turtle Bulletin

http://www.christianpost.com/article/20110204/testimony-of-lesbians-son-goes-viral-on-youtube/

Here’s an article that sounds like it’s objectively describing Zach and his testimony for the first few paragraphs.

It then goes onto gives quotes from the totally discredited American College of Pediatrics. There’s all sorts of nonsense in the article, but the best line is here: “Allowing them to marry lawfully would raise the divorce rate as well as increase the number of children brought up in a divorced households, Stephanowics contended.”

She’s absolutely right. If we actually allowed gays to *gasp* marry each other, then it’s inevitable that some would also divorce. And more divorce is a bad thing, therefore we shouldn’t allow gays to marry. Flawless reasoning.

AlexofND

Absolutely BRILLIANT! I love it! This has to be the best pro equal marriage speech I’ve ever heard! What a great way to wrap up the week.
-Alex

Richard Rush

justsearching, speaking of divorce:

Actually, if gays suddenly became seen as fully equal throughout society, I would expect an initial short-term increase in divorce rates followed by a long-term decrease. The initial increase would be among all the marriages where one spouse has been faking the straight. Then, after all those dysfunctional marriages are dissolved, we should see a decrease in divorce rates.

Richard Rush

Nineteen-year-old Zach is awesome! He is eloquent, passionate, expressive, and has a commanding voice and presence. He will be going places.

It reminds me of 2004 when I witnessed a guy I had never heard of give a powerful speech at the Democratic National Convention. Later, I told my partner about it and added, “I think that guy is going to president some day.” That guy was Barack Obama.

tavdy79

@ Richard Rush

In European countries which have legalised gay marriage or an equivalent there has been no short-term increase in divorce rates. In most cases the divorce rate was steadily increasing prior to legalisation of gay marriage or an equivalent, and the increase either slowed, levelled off or reversed subsequently.

I would actually expect almost the reverse of what you suggest – a rapid, short-to-medium term decrease in divorce levels, followed by a slow return to the pre-legalisation trend, with a probable slight reduction in divorce rates long-term. The key reason for this is that immediately after legalisation there will be a sharp increase in the number of marriages, many of which will be relationships that have already survived many years, even decades, so are less likely to end in divorce. I wouldn’t expect this short-term decrease to be mirrored by an increase in opposite-sex divorces where where one spouse is gay, because whether or not such marriages end isn’t related to whether or not gay marriage is legal, but rather to whether or not the gay partner has come to terms with their sexuality.

Lindoro Almaviva

His cuteness went beyond childhood.

Jon Trouten

@ justsearching:

Since gay couples began marrying in Iowa in 2009, the numbers of new marriages have actually gone up and the numbers of divorces have actually decreased to numbers not seen since 1970.

Jamie O\\\'Neill

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oBGJHrnziTc

It’s of interest that another young man, this time a twenty-year-old Christian, gave testimony at the same Iowa hearings. You can view it here:

(I call him Christian, because that’s how he introduced himself.) It must have been so very difficult for the good representatives in Iowa, weighing one testimony against the other, to decide whose argument best lent itself to reason, decency and their republican oath. My heart goes out to them.

Regan DuCasse

Good one Jamie!

A Christian like that never lets an opportunity go by that they can quote Scripture and use the Bible when speaking on gay lives.

Sad, the IA legis still voted against those gay lives and Zach Wahls.

Apparently, the quality by which he was raised, into the quality human being he became doesn’t matter as much as it should have.
As Zach said, his family and their love, endured despite a lot of things.

I’m NEVER impressed by Christians that say so at the expense of what’s right, honest and important.
What burns, is that THEY always think we others should be impressed.
Their words are nothing, their deeds, everything.

beachewtoy75

been avoiding watching because I knew I would cry!

He. Is. Awesome.

Richard Rush

@ tavdy79:

I wasn’t talking just about divorce as a result of legalizing same-sex marriage, but about “if gays suddenly became seen as fully equal throughout society.”

My imagining the future divorce rates is based on anecdotal evidence of increasing numbers of gay men already coming out of pretend-heterosexual marriages – people I know personally plus those I hear about. These are the kind of marriages that the “pro-family” crowd believes are preferable to living honestly, like Zach Wahls’ parents. If that crowd were truly pro-family, they would be insisting on full equality for gays, instead of promoting more deceptions resulting in dysfunctional marriages. I guess their motto is “Live a lie for God” because He knows it’s best for children grow up in dysfunctional households.

Timothy Kincaid

Their words are nothing, their deeds, everything.

Funny… some dude said something very similar about 2,000 years ago. The ironic thing is that they think they speak for him when they say the opposite of what he said.

Edwin

There goes another hate monger. He learned to be that way in 20 years.
Amazing when I was 20 I was in the service protecting our country. Yes I am gay. But I was taught god is Love. He does not hate anyone that he has created no matter what this bible thumpper says.

Edwin

Zach Wahls knows what family is all about. There would be less children in foster care if they would have let LGBT
people adopt kids years ago and less abused too.
Zach you are a true hero and you were raised by two great mothers.

Mihangel apYrs

We can give them facts, figures, examples, but as I’ve said they don’t care. Or as J Lucius Brutus commented on the same thread, they do care enough to destroy lives and families in advancee and maintenance of their bigotry.

The four archangels could flutter down and stand on the steps of the Capitol and state that ss marriage didn’t run contrary to god’law and they’d ignore them, Christ himself could descend and they’d ignore him. Because their bigotry is enabled by their religion not the reason for it.

We can’t use reason, we can only use politics and money.

justsearching

What happens to the divorce rate obviously depends on what you understand the divorce rate to be. It can be represented as a ratio of marriage to divorces in a given time frame, the probability that a marriage will end in divorce, or the total amount of divorces per 1000 people. If we’re talking about the third definition, then I think it’s inevitable that that the divorce rate would go up if gay marriage is allowed. The only way it wouldn’t go up is if, all other factors staying the same, 0% of gay marriages ended up in divorce. As for the other two ways of measuring divorce rates, I doubt allowing gay marriage will have too much of an effect one way or the other.

I’m sad to see that the Iowa House was unmoved by the appeals from Wahl and others.

Tara TASW

My wife and I have raised our niece since she was 14 years old. She’s now in her 20’s. The day after Prop H8 passed, my wife and I were too depressed to do much of anything. Our niece as at an anti-Prop-H8 rally, proudly sporting a sign that said, “What about MY family?”

Timothy Kincaid

I love your niece

Erin

February 6th, 2011

I watched a bit of the video Jaime referenced. How sad the young man’s first point was how the Bible supported the Divine Right of Kings to make his argument that religious law should dictate man’s law in a DEMOCRACY. I imagine this epic fail is downhill from there. ( I could only stomach a few more sentences of ignorance.)

Jimmy Mac

February 6th, 2011

I saw Zach on Lawrence O’Donnells MSNBC “The Last Word” last week. He was by far the most articulate of his family – and excellent eye candy as well.

Talking With

http://patv.tv/blog/2011/04/06/talking-with-yale-cohn-with-zach-wahls/

Hereâ€™s a TV interview we just did with Zach Wahls where he talks about what it was like growing up with two mothers, what led him to decide to go and speak before the House of Representatives, how his life has changed after being thrust into the public eye, and what other young people can do to fight for equality and speak out against intolerance.

Richard Rush

Zach Wahls is surely one of Maggie Gallagher’s worst nightmares.

Richard Rush

http://www.boxturtlebulletin.com/2011/04/08/31767

Well, Zach may be one of Maggie Gallagher’s worst nightmares, but apparently her worst nightmare is Louis Marinelli.

Timothy Kincaid