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What “Grace and Truth” Look Like in the Exodus Church Network

Timothy Kincaid

July 27th, 2009

Exodus International is the umbrella organization for protestant ex-gay ministries. And one of Exodus’ latest emphases is its Exodus Church Network. This is an affiliation of churches of various denominations through which Exodus hopes to equip chuches to be a pivotal part of healing and restoration.

One, we hope to exhort the church at-large to stand confidently and boldly on the truth of scripture with regard to homosexuality. Two, we hope to equip churches to minister to the individuals within their own congregation who are struggling with unwanted homosexuality, as well as the family members of a gay loved one. And three, we hope to create a nationwide referral list of churches, including your church, for those who are searching for a church family that will walk alongside them in their journey.

Alan Chambers, the President of Exodus, often speaks of how churches need to become loving and welcoming of those “struggling with homosexuality”. But what does this loving welcome look like?

In the Exodus Church Network application package, Exodus emphasizes the importance of these churches in the life of the struggler.

Central to this redemption is Exodus’ desire to unite and equip the Church to carry out this healing process. Exodus bridges the gap between Christians who respond to homosexual men and women with ignorance and fear, and those who uphold homosexuality as a valid, Christ-centered lifestyle. To Exodus, both extremes fail to convey to the homosexual the fullness of redemption found in Christ – He who embodies grace and truth, and invites us to partake of Him.

If would certainly appear, from this, that Exodus Churches do not respond with “ignorance and fear.” Rather, they convey “grace and truth.” But what does this grace and truth look like?

To get a sense of the ideal Exodus Church, perhaps we can look to Alan Chambers’ newest book, Leaving Homosexuality. In this book, Chambers again takes “the church” to task and implies what an Exodus Church does better.

In fact, if I had one thing to say to my fellow believers who are the body of Christ regarding how we have historically treated homosexuals it would be, “We were wrong in our attitudes and thus mishandled the situation.” In the name of Christ many people helped create the angry and bitter Pro-gay Movement because of their pride and arrogance and un-Christlike heart toward people in need. Let’s wake up. Let’s repent of our hostility and recommit to boldly loving sinners as Christ did…and does.

So an Exodus Church will not treat homosexuals as they historically have but would instead boldly love sinners as Christ did and does. But what does this bold love look like?


Perhaps we can look at the ideal Exodus Church, the one that Exodus so admires that the pastor has spoken at Exodus’ Freedom Conference, the church so in line with boldly loving grace and truth that Alan Chambers invited the pastor to write a recommendation published with his new book: Miles McPherson of The Rock Church in San Diego. Here’s what McPherson said about Chambers’ new book:

Alan’s stories will break your heart, convict your conscience, and hopefully inspire today’s church to reexamine its message on this complex issue.

But what does this reexamined message look like?

You may recall The Rock as being the home church of “opposite marriage” endorser Carrie Prejean. But The Rock and Miles McPherson are so much more: they are examples of what Exodus upholds as a glowing beacon of Christlike love for homosexuals as expressed in grace and truth.

So what does grace and truth looks like at The Rock?

Well, according to this article written by Miles McPherson and hosted on The Rock Church’s website:

God’s Word tells us differently and He provides us of the evidence that homosexuality is not natural or normal. There are physiological repercussions from homosexual behavior; male homosexuals are 430 times more likely to contract HIV than a heterosexual, while heterosexuals have a 1-in-750,000 chance of contracting the virus responsible for HIV, a male homosexual has a 1-in-165 chance of getting HIV. A 20 year old gay male has a 30% chance of either dying or contracting AIDS before the age of 30. They are also 23 times more likely to get other sexually transmitted diseases than a heterosexual.

There are also moral repercussions stemming from homosexual behavior as evidenced by the fact that one third of all sexual crimes against children are committed by homosexuals even though they are representative of only one percent of the population. Pedophilia has even been called central to the gay lifestyle. The agenda of the North American Man Boy Love Association (NAMBLA) is to lower the age of consent so that sex with children will be legal.

Emotionally people suffer from homosexuality. Gays are five times more likely to commit suicide than a straight person. They are suffering depression because of God’s judgment and their alienation from Him. So God not only tells us what is right and wrong but that by continually doing what is wrong there will be consequences and this is all evident to us so we have no excuse in suppressing the truth.

and

The homosexual agenda is being pushed upon this nation, to the point where it may become illegal for pastors to preach against homosexuality from the pulpit, that is where even such preaching is deemed a crime. In some countries this is already the case.

and

It is clear among statistics that homosexual relationships are mainly about sex, this is attributed to the fact of the amount of sexual partners a homosexual person has a year, regardless of whether he is in a monogamous “marriage” relationship.

This is presented, of course, as justification for McPherson’s and The Rock Church’s political efforts to deny rights to gay and lesbian Californians. And, of course, as an example of The Rock’s “grace and truth.”

Have we heard all of this before? Yes, we have. And we have debunked it time and time again.

These are lies. They are not misstatements, they are not exagerations, they are not misunderstandings. They are deliberate and intentional demonizations of gay men and women with the express intent of horrifying the reader and firing them up to attack the civil rights and liberties of the segment of the population that McPherson despises.

Oh but wait, it gets better:

Recently in Pennsylvania, a woman was arrested and sentenced for 47 years in prison because she had the following bumper sticker: God loves homosexuals, but homosexuality is a sin. This is only one of the many current and shocking examples of Christian prosecution presented in today’s message.

WFT?? This is a new one even for me. And it’s a new one for Google as well. This appears to be a flat out fabrication, apparantly made up by Miles McPherson himself to scare his flock through ignorance and instill hatred and fear of gay people, precisely what Chambers claims to oppose.

This is evil.

This is what “grace and truth” looks like in the Exodus Church Network.

Comments

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Aaron
July 27th, 2009 | LINK

“This is evil”

Indeed.

Alex
July 27th, 2009 | LINK

I absolutely agree that this is evil.

Thanks for the great deconstruction, Timothy. This is why I love Box Turtle Bulletin.

Alan
July 27th, 2009 | LINK

I wonder if Exodus realizes their mission is in vain.

Haven’t they heard the saying, “When you see an ambulance, it’s either a gay rights opponent dying or a gay rights supporter being born.”?

Our side’s winning this one.

----
July 27th, 2009 | LINK

Isn’t there a way to respond these blatant lies and make most people notice Exodus and co. are full of it? This is most likely the reason why we still have no equal rights across the country.

Christopher™
July 27th, 2009 | LINK

I hate the constant lies… I really do.

This is yet another example of why I believe that rabidly anti-gay Christians are rabidly anti-gay and willing to lie endlessly NOT because they had a “God moment” after they read a handful of verses in their NIV Bible that convinced them that homosexuals are “offenders.”

No, I believe that rabidly anti-gay Christians are rabidly anti-gay and willing to lie repeatedly–even though that’s clearly a sin–because they are *already* deeply prejudiced against gay people regardless of what may or may not be in the Bible. Their interpretation of the Bible simply gives them cover for their bigotry. Because when you debunk their lies and take apart their bad Scriptural exegesis, you’re left with, “Well, I just think it’s wrong,” or “It’s not natural.” In discussions with anti-gay Christians, this happens ALL the time.

Add fear and a false sense of persecution to the mix, and there’s an even greater urgency to lie. “Don’t you realize? Civilization is being threatened!”

In my opinion, all this can be boiled down to one issue: right-wing Christians are disgusted by anal sex. (Regardless of the fact that not all gay people do it, and a lot of straight people do).

To them, Gay Person = AnalAnalAnalAnalAnalNonStop24/7.

It’s a pathetic and childish response, and we should just go there and call it out for what it is. Anal sex is the big elephant in the room, and those of us on the pro-gay side should stop avoiding it when we get in these kinds of discussions.

The Jews thought that Samaritans did disgusting things, too, and Jesus called them out on that. We should be just as blunt.

Once you bring sex out into the open, it’s then and only then that you can discuss how behavior does not define orientation, how the two are separate, and how the Bible doesn’t even deal with the concept of orientation at all.

We also shouldn’t let the other side get away with the word, “lifestyle,” either, which is a Right-Wing Scare Word™ that can only mean the worst things imaginable when it’s left undefined.

Mike Airhart
July 27th, 2009 | LINK

OK, Exodus is a bunch of liars. And?

What course of action is being suggested here?

a. mcewen
July 27th, 2009 | LINK

Sometimes the best course of action is to point out the lies. While a lot of us are aware of these things involving Exodus and other religious right/ex-gay groups, a lot of lgbts and heterosexuals aren’t.

But I do see your point, Mike. We are amassing a lot of knowledge but the question is how can we bring it to everyone.

Burr
July 27th, 2009 | LINK

Okay.. it’s one thing to make up or trump up some controversy over free speech concerns, but 47 years? Who the hell would believe that garbage? Oh right the lizard brained moronic bigots he’s banging his bible on..

If that was even remotely true, then why are they so worried about hate crime legislation? Seems like free speech has already been voided in their eyes! Guess they can’t keep track of all the BS they’re spewing.

I guess they’re pissing that they don’t have any REAL injustice to complain about.. like oh say.. not getting to see their dying loved ones in the hospital..

Mike Airhart
July 27th, 2009 | LINK

“A,” many of Exodus’ members pay little attention to Exodus leaders’ lies and, when occasionally confronted, deny that Exodus leaders are saying and doing what they are, in fact, saying and doing.

I’ve been suggesting since March of this year that people begin confronting local Exodus members regularly, and remind them that they are being held publicly accountable for their association with vigilantism in Uganda, their involuntary detentions in the U.S., their opposition to anti-bullying programs, and their support for lenient punishment of antigay violence.

Exodus will not change, so long as its critics hide in their own echo chambers.

Gay Christian 101
July 27th, 2009 | LINK

Exodus Man says:

I love you BUT while I defend my right to marry an orientation compatible partner, I will do everything in my power to make sure you gays and lesbians never enjoy the legal right to marry an orientation compatible partner.

I love you BUT while I defend my right to more than 1138 federal legal rights via my heterosexual marriage, I will do everything in my power to make sure gays and lesbians never enjoy those rights for their committed partnerships.

I love you BUT while I defend my right to adopt children, I will do everything in my power to make sure you gays and lesbians never enjoy the right to adopt children.

I love you BUT while I defend my right to be free from housing and job discrimination based on my heterosexual orientation, I will do everything in my power to make sure you gays and lesbians will never be free from housing and job discrimination because of your homosexual orientation.

I love you BUT while I defend the right of heterosexuals to proudly serve our country in the U.S. military, I will do everything in my power to make sure gays and lesbians never enjoy the right to openly serve our country in the U.S. military.

I love you BUT while I defend my right to a legal, loving sexual relationship with my wife, I will do everything in my power to make sure you gays and lesbians never enjoy a legal, loving sexual relationship with the long-term partner fitting your sexual orientation.

I love you BUT…

Hey, why are you backing away from me?

I love you! I really do – I can’t understand why you think I don’t love you.”

David C.
July 27th, 2009 | LINK

Eventually, some religious organizations or “churches” will join Exodus Church Network, and when they do, they will make that claim in some public way. Once they can be identified, they can be contacted with the truth. That’s how you fight ignorance and lies: with the truth.

Tell the truth all the time when dealing with these kinds of organizations.

Jake
July 27th, 2009 | LINK

Lies Lies Lies Lies Lies

About the woman arrested for having the bumper sticker, give me a ****ing break. If that were even remotely true, there would non-stop news coverage.

I think Exodus is actually referring to the eleven “Repent America” whack jobs who protested Philadelphia’s Outfest Block Party in 2004. They were arrested and allegedly faced a maximum 47 years each. The charges were dropped.

Snopes: http://www.snopes.com/politics/religion/inpublic.asp

I love Snopes, but I wish they would change their “claim” here. These people were not arrested for preaching, they were arrested for blocking a street and being disorderly.

Quo
July 27th, 2009 | LINK

“I’ve been suggesting since March of this year that people begin confronting local Exodus members regularly, and remind them that they are being held publicly accountable for their association with vigilantism in Uganda, their involuntary detentions in the U.S., their opposition to anti-bullying programs, and their support for lenient punishment of antigay violence.”

Mike, that sounds obnoxious and quite pointless. It’s borderline harrassment, as well as simply rude.

el polacko
July 28th, 2009 | LINK

i remember when there were those who were embarrassed by act up for being so ‘radical’ even though we were being completely ignored as we were dying by the thousands.
if we are unwilling to confront those who spread such vicious lies about us because that would be “rude”, then we will never win our full legal equality.

Nancye
July 28th, 2009 | LINK

“Gays are five times more likely to commit suicide than a straight person. They are suffering depression because of God’s judgment and their alienation from Him.”

Of course thats why …couldn’t possibly be anything to do with persecution, bashings, fear of discrimination, negative judgements from the church , being made homeless, suffering alienation from family and friends, and being made to feel somehow less through no fault of their own. Of course its Gods fault!!

cowboy
July 28th, 2009 | LINK

Mr. Airhart,

You ask: What course of action?

It was with the help of our hetero-friends on Comedy Central that packed the biggest punch to our foes. How much damage did Jon Stewart do on his Daily Show with a segment he had about curing the gay? I watched a couple of entertaining YouTube videos which went viral regarding the lies during (and after) the California’s Proposition 8 campaign. The tactics in this war with the anti-gay can best be fought by being savvy with reaching a broader audience on the internet.

It seems to me the best results are when we humiliate our foes with political talk shows on cable and the internet…and a little humor involved doesn’t hurt.

Jason Echols
July 28th, 2009 | LINK

Hey, thanks for the tip, here’s the clip of Miles:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LeQ8d0CJkMM

McPherson’s 2008 performance reminds me of Ron Prentice’s recent FUDfest, if you’ve got time for a double feature:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1c5o3JAaIco

Regan DuCasse
July 28th, 2009 | LINK

Not a bad idea cowboy.
And Quo…that was a complaint, not a suggestion for a course of action.

I agree with cowboy about humor. But the execution Lawrence King, or the suicides of Carl Walker-Hoover and Jaheem (can’t remember his last name) or the attacks on Sean Kennedy or the Suzuchanay brothers are examples of language that Miles McPherson uses, manifests as serious violence in schools and the streets. Crimes and harassment committed by VERY young people at that.

One can make an easy comparison to the information that FRC and so on distort, to Nazi tracts and segregationists propaganda. It is primitively unfortunate that the public embraces such information because it’s easier, than actually KNOWING someone gay.
After all, they also make it hard to be honest about it, therefore a discussion impossible.
We are confronted at this time with the opposition HIDING away and making themselves unavailable for an open dialogue and refutation of their lies.

Even in broadcast media, it’s difficult to get a word in.
There seems to be a vast conspiracy of silencing gay people by not showing up to the arena. How can you speak to who isn’t there?

How can you make yourself visible to people who refuse to see you, until you do or something extreme happens?
And by that point, the complaint is how ‘in your face’ gay folks are.

Incredibly frustrating, even for me.
I’m not sure what to suggest either, in light of this reality.
But I for damn sure am working on it!

Mike Airhart
July 28th, 2009 | LINK

Wow, Quo,

So now it’s rude to tell Exodus member churches that they are supporting vigilantism and imprisonment in Barbados and Uganda.

It’s borderline harassment to tell Exodus member churches in our home states that they support bullying and lenient punishment for antigay hate crimes.

The Exodus Church Network already has over 100 member churches, which are supplanting the dwindling number of bona fide ex-gay “ministries.”

I see no reason to limit our message to friendly venues where passive viewers and readers take no action to stop the aggressive efforts of ex-gay programs to harm individuals and destroy families.

fannie
July 28th, 2009 | LINK

So Exodus doesn’t find lesbians problematic at all? Or are they just not aware that lesbians exist?

Sweet.

Phallocentric, much?

Swampfox
July 28th, 2009 | LINK

“So Exodus doesn’t find lesbians problematic at all? Or are they just not aware that lesbians exist?

Sweet.

Phallocentric, much?”, fannie

Of course, it is all really about male homosexuality. Women behaving in an affectionate way toward one another in our society is not condemned as gay men are condemned.

fannie
July 28th, 2009 | LINK

That is true, Swampfox.

But the continual erasure of lesbians is also problematic in its own right.

Swampfox
July 28th, 2009 | LINK

Fannie, I don’t think that it is the “erasure” of lesbians. I believe that there is more acceptance of lesbians than of gay men.

----
July 28th, 2009 | LINK

“So Exodus doesn’t find lesbians problematic at all? Or are they just not aware that lesbians exist?”

They are also targets (or casualties) of ex-gay ministries. A couple of years ago a lesbian who founded a women’s magazine became a born-again Christian, “renounced” her homosexuality, and became celibate.

Also, Sue Bohlin from Probe Ministries ran an article supporting conversion therapy, mentioning two lesbians, “Diane” and “Carol”, who supposedly lived happily as a couple until suddenly God told them what they were doing was wrong and broke up.

----
July 28th, 2009 | LINK

This is the article I got that claim from:

http://www.probe.org/site/c.fdKEIMNsEoG/b.4217825/k.6148/Can_Homosexuals_Change.htm

Christopher™
July 28th, 2009 | LINK

“I believe that there is more acceptance of lesbians than of gay men.”

I don’t think lesbians are “more accepted” by right-wing Christians whatsoever. They’re just harder to demonize.

The right-wing’s only (false) claim against lesbians is that they have a higher incidence of domestic violence. But since most men don’t care about violence against women, that kind of demonization is a non-starter.

However… gay men can stick their penises up another guy’s rectum. Now that’s DISGUSTING! In fact, it’s an ABOMINATION! (add reverb for greater impact).

Right-wing men find anal sex to be a personal affront against their masculinity, and right-wing women just think it’s gross. Kids think anything sexual is gross–and if they’re young enough, they’ll believe anything their parents tell them–so you’ve got them on board, too.

NOW… you have the necessary motivation to get every right-wing family onto the streets and into the voting booths to stop any equal rights that gay people want. It works every time.

Remember, to these people, Gay = Anal Sex. The more we realize this, the more often we can address it and deal with it.

fannie
July 28th, 2009 | LINK

I agree with Christopher. I don’t think right-wing Christians are more accepting of lesbians I think it’s more that they genuinely just don’t think about lesbians as much as they do about gay men because gay men are easier to demonize. That’s why to anti-gays, Gay = Male, and Gay Sex = Anal Sex.

However, once you point out to anti-gays that they are completely ignoring lesbians, they will usually retort with something along the lines of “oh yeah, lesbians are gross/bad/immoral too.”

Even the anti-gay movement treats gay men as the default gay human being. Just as gay men so often do.

Quo
July 28th, 2009 | LINK

Mike,

Yes, it’s rude and pointless to “remind” Exodus members that Exodus supports “vigilantism in Uganda”, among other things. It implies that Exodus members are stupid. If they aren’t stupid, you don’t need to “remind” them of anything, and if they are, it won’t do any good.

It’s also vaguely threatening to tell them that they are being held “accountable” (how exactly?) for their association with Exodus, so that would count as harrassment. Your suggestion sounds to me more like a way of relieving your own frustration and anger at Exodus than anything else.

Timothy Kincaid
July 28th, 2009 | LINK

fannie,

So Exodus doesn’t find lesbians problematic at all? Or are they just not aware that lesbians exist?

Oh, they don’t have to address lesbians. If the man of the household is doing what God called him to do, he’ll enforce a Christian social ethic. You little ladies just have to be obedient and submissive to the will of God and your father or husband.

See? No problem at all.

I’m kidding, of course. Exodus does try to address lesbians. It’s just a secondary program priority, mostly, I suspect, because they get more men in their programs than women.

Timothy Kincaid
July 28th, 2009 | LINK

Yes, it’s rude and pointless to “remind” Exodus members that Exodus supports “vigilantism in Uganda”, among other things. It implies that Exodus members are stupid.

Most are just unaware of what the national organization does. Very few are aware of Alan’s anti-gay political activism and when it is mentioned, quite often they get uncomfortable.

Similarly, I’m willing to bet that hardly any know of Schmeirer’s little trip to Uganda.

Emproph
July 28th, 2009 | LINK

Alan Chambers: “To Exodus, both extremes fail to convey to the homosexual…”

“The” homosexual writing this comment feels that “its” portrayal as an object is not without intent.

“Most are just unaware of what the national organization does. Very few are aware of Alan’s anti-gay political activism and when it is mentioned, quite often they get uncomfortable.”

Perhaps some more discomforting education is in order.

I would also be in favor of a ministry-of-the-day / exposé section, for those ministries who—after having been educated on the exploits of EI—choose to remain complicit.

They may not respond to contact, but they might respond to a Google search that brings up an unflattering BTB article on them. At least it would get them in the system and beyond our echo chamber.

And rightfully so, I might add: hate-speech = hatred = hate crime.

I’ve come to the conclusion that to the extent that their lies are intentional, the end result of them is also intentional.

Lynn David
July 28th, 2009 | LINK

Care to bet Chambers put off the publication date of his new book until after the election so it wouldn’t be an issue in the the Prop H8 vote?

Quo
July 29th, 2009 | LINK

“Remind” and “regularly” imply that people should be told something over and over again. That would be harrassment. It’s also very condescending.

Emily K
July 29th, 2009 | LINK

fannie, this is something I’ve been pointing out for a while, and you’re absolutely right. I think a lot of it has to do with what I see as misogyny in the form of homophobia. Men who are “passive” during sex acts are “lowering” themselves to the status of women. Two women being sexual? Please. Women are sexual entertainment for men. And since they’re *already* the lowest on the sexual totem pole, who cares if they’re making “passive” partners out of one another? I think it would be difficult for a straight homophobe to demonize lesbian sexual acts if he simultaneously is aroused by them (and not threatened by such arousal, unlike the same situation involving male acts).

I’m speaking mostly in hyperbole. Naturally, not all men think that way. I have my doubts that most straight men think that way, as a matter of fact.

I myself took a shot at the “activism through humor on the internet” thing with my “National Organization for Mammary Enhancement” and “Jugs 4 Jesus” site. It was a lot of fun! I doubt I’ll be updating it anymore – too busy with other stuff – but I’m proud of what it was and I was not the first and won’t be the last; there are many talented people out there who can keep such activism going. And I hope to return to it soon, with other ideas. This relates a lot to my Jewish heritage. A lot of us became comedians and entertainers to cope with stigmatization and neutralize hostile attitudes toward Jewish people.

Harvey Milk was a product of both. â_â

Christopher Waldrop
July 29th, 2009 | LINK

Quo, do you have a problem with the harassment promoted by Exodus members, including their support for the anti-gay laws of Uganda? I just want to be clear. You seem quite happy to attack anyone who criticizes Exodus, saying their statements are “condescending” and “pointless”, and yet, curiously, you don’t say anything about Alan Chambers and other Exodus members. Maybe you do have a problem with them as well and you’re simply trying to correct what you see as an imbalance here, but, if you do have a problem with Exodus, it’s curious that you don’t mention it.

timothy kincaid
July 29th, 2009 | LINK

Emily, I agree. But I think it goes further than just sexual passivity. Many religious conservatives believe that G-d has assigned specific gender roles and that a gay man is in defiance of G-d by not fulfilling his leadership destiny. Perhaps lesbians are less obviously in “defiance” because it isn’t socially acceptable to demand that they be subjective.

While it may not be offensive to demand that leaders be leaders, you just can’t demand that women be quiet and obedient any more. Or not publicly, at least.

fannie
July 29th, 2009 | LINK

Thanks Emily. To go along with what you said, I think that homophobes criticize lesbian sex less often than they criticize sex between two men because under their worldview, two women having sex just isn’t as “important” or “real” as two men having sex.

So, while certainly it may look as though lesbians are more accepted or are given a pass by homophobes, it’s really a slap in the face that says lesbians aren’t even important enough to be criticized. Lesbians are just “playing around” at sex and relationships.

Alex
July 29th, 2009 | LINK

Emproph,

You bring up a great point about the connection between hate speech and hate crime. Anti-gay Christians refuse to admit it, but I often wonder how sharply violence against the LGBT community would decrease if we’d stop hearing that gays are evil, that we helped cause 9/11 and Hurricane Katrina, that we’re a threat to children, etc.

Quo
July 29th, 2009 | LINK

Christopher,

There are plenty of ways I disagree with Exodus, but, for a variety of reasons, I have not considered it particularly worthwhile to discuss them.

However, since you ask if I am critical of them: I find it regrettable that they have allied themselves with an anti-gay campaign in Uganda that emphasises seduction of adolescents by homosexual adults as a cause of homosexuality.

Such theories about homosexuality serve an ideological function: placing the blame for homosexuality on homosexuals collectively and denying the responsibility of heterosexuals for homosexuality. Undoubtedly many people find this to be convenient and more emotionally acceptable than the alternative, but it’s no closer to the truth about homosexuality than the silly born-that-way theories of gay activists.

Ben in Oakland
July 29th, 2009 | LINK

“it’s no closer to the truth about homosexuality than the silly born-that-way theories of gay activists.”

It’sd only silly if you really don’t like the fact that you were born that way.

But if you are not born that way, then it seems like it must be fairly simple to choose. you need only look at alan chambers to see the truth of that.

Burr
July 29th, 2009 | LINK

Personally I’m not _completely_ sold on the “born-that-way” thing, mostly because while the genetic element plays a demonstrably large role it seems to be a little more complex, and also because it could turn into a dual-edged sword of trying to prevent it.

The notion that it’s heterosexuals’ fault is completely absurd however. Sorry but I don’t fit the self-serving, ludicrous theoretical story that people that can’t possibly understand my experience try to constantly pin on me.

Emily K
July 29th, 2009 | LINK

It’s okay, all the Heteros out there, trust me you are NOT responsible for me. Consider yourself lucky, too. =^._.^=

Timothy Kincaid
July 30th, 2009 | LINK

Re: the etiology of sexual orientation:

We do not at this time fully understand how orientation comes to be in an individual. It may well be that there are multiple paths to ones orientation with various variables.

However, we do know that for at least some persons there is a genetic contribution but that genes likely do not work alone. Additionally, observed traits (e.g. physical body parts, spacial negotiation, brain section sizes, etc.) suggest that a biological determination – whether genetic or other pre-natal influences – is highly suggestive in many gay males.

We do not yet have any conclusive evidence – or any evidence at all other than retrospective recollection – that supports a socialization or other “nurture” basis.

We know that if male homosexuality is not determined at birth, it is generally understood to be well established very early in life, probably before 4 years old in most gay males.

We also know that there has been no successful repeatable method that has yet been discovered by which a gay male can rid himself of same-sex attractions and replace them with opposite-sex attractions.

Now back to the subject of the thread which is not whether born-gay theories are silly. Rather it is whether the Exodus Church Network is permiated by messages of demonization, hatred, and viscious lies.

ravenbiker
August 3rd, 2009 | LINK

Yup. Evil it is.

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